Talk:Embassy of Taiwan, Holy See

Requested move 3 April 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. The opposers made valid points, but overwhelming support was received by the proposal per WP:CONCISE, WP:COMMON among other policies. (closed by non-admin page mover) —CX Zoom[he/him] ^{(let's talk • C • L)} 14:13, 22 April 2022 (UTC)

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Embassy of the Republic of China (Taiwan) to the Holy See → Embassy of Taiwan, Holy See – moved the more appealing and condensed title, Republic of Taiwan, Holy See to it's long form, "Embassy of the Republic of China (Taiwan) to the Holy See. please see Wikipedia:Naming conventions (government and legislation). Please, don't make it a stand out article from others. follow the standard, that is being used in naming the diplomatic missions. Please, refrain from using the long, official, governmental names (Please do not include the official names of the country, as the rest diplomatic missions never use them, anyways, and aren't used here as well.) Utkarsh555 17:25, 3 April 2022 (UTC)}— Relisting. Spekkios (talk) 22:47, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

Oppose. Based on the WP:NCGAL, the very first point says 'Use official names in article titles', in which that Embassy of the Republic of China (Taiwan) to the Holy See is exactly written in their official English-language website of the embassy. Based on MOS:NC-CN, the term People's Republic of China is used when discussing about politics or diplomatic relations, thus the same applied to the Republic of China. For Taiwan case, due to their political nature, their representative office's name is really unique with case by case basis. For countries which recognize Republic of China as the sole government of China, the term Embassy of the Republic of China is used. While those countries who recognize People's Republic of China as the sole legitimate government of China, they will use Taipei Representative Office or even Taiwan Representative Office (for Lithuania and Somaliland) and their variant. Each of this has their own reason, and thus can't be standardize for every Taiwan's embassy or representative office to be just Taiwan Embassy of xxx. Over time, these naming might change due to political change across the Taiwan Strait, thus exact official naming is really desired to represent the current situation of Taiwan/ROC's diplomatic relations. Chongkian (talk) 00:42, 4 April 2022 (UTC)

• Support. The more common abbreviation should really be used. I agree to the name change.--Beta Lohman (talk) 20:10, 4 April 2022 (UTC)
• Support, more concise and equally informative, if not more so (the current name could be a bit confusing). BD2412 T 03:26, 5 April 2022 (UTC)

  @BD2412 @Beta Lohman Thanks for your support. also, Please understand, don't use the "Complete, long and official names" of the country while in its official diplomatic mission abroad. Utkarsh555 15:38, 5 April 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose per User:Chongkian, who makes a strong policy-based argument. 162 etc. (talk) 17:26, 5 April 2022 (UTC)
• Support, per WP:CONSISTENT, WP:CONCISE, WP:NATURAL, and WP:RECOGNIZABLE. The proposed title is consistent with other embassies to the Holy See, such as Embassy of the United States, Holy See, Embassy of the Philippines, Holy See, and Embassy of Colombia, Holy See. It is also more natural and recognizable, as demonstrated by the need to disambiguate the current title with "Taiwan", and per ngrams which shows the common name of Taiwan is "Taiwan", not "Republic of China". BilledMammal (talk) 07:44, 12 April 2022 (UTC)
• Support. Taiwan is the name we use for this country. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:28, 13 April 2022 (UTC)
• Support. I will note though, Taiwan and the Holy See's diplomatic relations in general are one of the more complex examples, so the consistency argument is less compelling, given how few actual Embassies Taiwan has (in contrast with their 100+ de facto Embassy like Cultural/Economic Centers). That said the format of Embassy of X, Location is preferable/simpler/shorter per WP:COMMON and WP:CONCISE. I am appreciative of the redirects of the longer/official names, but highly doubt people would search for exact phrasing. Note the consensus of this discussion is likely relevant for Embassy of Taiwan, Mbabane name too. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 20:13, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

  @162 etc.@BD2412@Beta Lohman@BilledMammal@Chongkian@Necrothesp@Shushugah

  If you have reached a conclusion, then please complete the action. Utkarsh555 09:44, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

  The admin could move to the page. --Beta Lohman※Office box 15:58, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.