Talk:Emblem of Laos

 Done Coat of arms of Laos

The following is an archive of the request made at the Graphic Lab Images to Improve page. Feel free to add your comments , but please do not alter the archived discussion.

• 
  b/w variant
• old arms show basic color scheme
  old arms show basic color scheme
• colors are more garish, but show how temple is colored
  colors are more garish, but show how temple is colored
• fifth upload with text in Laos script, rather than a tracing
  fifth upload with text in Laos script, rather than a tracing

File:Wappen laos sw.svg

Article: Coat of arms of Laos

Request: In looking for information on the above Laos Scout emblem (thanks so much, guys), I found that we have a black-and-white coat of arms rather than a colored one. I would like it colored. Chris 05:06, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Graphist opinion: I imagine you'd want an SVG? If so I'll have a go but I might mess up: that's all I seem to have done recently. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 15:13, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm sure you'll do just fine, Dave, and thank you for your hard work and contributions! Chris 18:30, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

:) Here's a first upload: I did the bottom half of the image and the temple accurately, but I did a rough version of everything else so you can get an idea of the colours and the finished image. I didn't trace the text, however, as I didn't think a trace would look good. If someone could help with this I'd appreciate this. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 10:19, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I had to blow this up, it's so nice! You have a great eye for detail! It's great! Maybe some of those that helped with the language requests on the Laotian Scout emblem can be persuaded to help with the text? Chris 20:04, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that! I'll start on detailing the areas at the sides (I think it's Maize?) tomorrow. If someone could create an SVG similar to this one made for the Burma Scouting request it would help a lot.--Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 22:24, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

The article about the symbol states that the crop depicted is ears of ripe rice. Valentinian ^{T / C} 23:54, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I've added the ears of rice, and most of the rest of the stuff that I did roughly. Any comments? I had some difficulty making out the smaller details. The next thing to do will be changing the trees on the right to the design on the b/w version (rather than that of the PNG above). --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 20:41, 24 July 2007 (UTC). Also, some of the parts of the rice may need tweaking. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 20:42, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

I went ahead and refined it some more. I did the trees properly, and added the text, but I'm not sure if it looks the part. Any Thoughts? --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 16:19, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Very nice! Can the text be thickened at all? Chris 21:17, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Very good job. Agree with Chris that the lettering could need some thickening. Btw, the fair use image shows a multicoloured tree. Not sure what type it is though. Valentinian ^{T / C} 21:36, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

It's on my to-do list! --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 21:46, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

ps-once you get the text nailed, can you also add it to the Commons image Image:Laos coa.png, as the same text is supposed to be on there, and will then make it a Wikipedia image and not a copyrighted version. Chris 04:39, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Here's some Thickened Text, and a Multi-coloured tree. If I have chance I'll try to add the text to the png image but I'm going on holiday tomorrow and I'm a little bit busy, so I probably won't have time. If the text needs more thickening, or something else needs changing, I'd request that someone else modifies the image. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 12:56, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm back! However, I'm not sure adding the text from the SVG to The vector-images.com PNG would be okay as far as licenses are concerned, and commons:Template_talk:Vector-Images.com has only confused me. I'd appreciate it if someone could confirm that modifying Image:Laos coa.png be ok. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 17:18, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Unfortunately, the images from Vector-images have become something of a problem. As I understand the situation: a representative for this company has accepted that Wikipedia and others use and modify their raster images as long as we don't do the same with the company's own vector images, so the raster images are freebie images but the company's own vector images aren't. So the problem isn't the company in Russia - as long as you base your work on a raster image, you're in the clear. The remaining problem is determining the copyright status of an official insignia of Laos, as it is in the country itself, and finding a copy of the Laotian copyright law (if such a law actually exists) is rather difficult. Laos is not a member of the Berne convention and the only small pieces of information I can dig up seem to suggest that copyright protection in Laos is very weak; no law as such seems to exist, only a ministerial decree from 1995 (possibly the one about trademarks?). [1]. The trademark decreee is no help, although § 12 specifies that a trademark cannot be registered if it contains a flag, coat of arms or similar.[2]. In any case, a thorough description of the insignia is specified in the Laotian constitution § 90 [3] so this description must be PD like any other law I can think of. Respecting copyright and all that, I think we're in the clear here, e.g. Heather Meeker has described Laos as a country with no copyright law at all.[4] Valentinian ^{T / C} 20:34, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Wow, that's fantastic research, that really helps a lot! I agree, the image looks like a PD image, but which image tag do you think would be best? I looked in WP:ICT for PD tags, but I couldn't find a specific tag that would be appropriate, apart from {{PD-because}}. I checked Image:Flag of Laos.svg, which is tagged with {{Insignia}} and {{{PD-Self}}. DO you think the the same should be done for the coat-of-arms, or should a new tag be made (for Laos COA and flags)?

On another note, on one of the links Valentinian had a link to the font for the Laos script. I'll use this to generate the text instead of just tracing it as soon as I can. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 08:37, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I would suggest going with the same solution as used on the flag. Normally, I don't like it, but it seems appropriate here. I like the idea about creating a {{PD-Laos-exempt}} template, but we should wait until we've analysed the situation more thoroughly. Just in case anybody wondered what applies to the seal of Astana (also on this page), that one is covered by commons:template:PD-KZ-exempt, and I've compiled a list of mostly East European countries where I've checked if official heraldry is PD or not, see: User:Valentinian/Heraldry. Valentinian ^{T / C} 09:21, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Update: Laos indeed has no copyright law at the moment, but it is expected to introduce an intellectual property decree in the future.[5] (page 39 in the original, page 41 in the file). The relevant text has apparently been drafted, but not yet signed into law. We should probably wait with a template until the new law becomes publicised. Valentinian ^{T / C} 09:36, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I uploaded with licenses as per the flag. Text is in the Laos Script font, so it looks better than the simple tracing of the text. Is it okay? Also, thanks very much for all the help with he licensing, Valentinian, it's really helped. User:Valentinian/Heraldry looks like it'll be really useful too. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 14:42, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I finally got round to adding the text to Image:Laos_coa.png, but I haven't uploaded yet, as I'm not sure the result is any good (I'm not so good with raster graphics, and the image is quite small). You can see the image here, and if it's any good then it can be uploaded. If not, then maybe some GIMP/Photoshop expert can help. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 08:36, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Image uploaded to Commons, and replaced in article. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 13:50, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Dave, they're both great, thank you! This one is done! I notice Coat of arms of Myanmar has been deleted from Commons, maybe that one should be tackled? Chris 19:06, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

I'll take a look at that when I have chance. --Dave the Rave (DTR)talk 09:14, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

The coat have wrong text. ສາທາລະນະລັດ ປະຊາທິປະໄຕ ປະຊາຊົນລາວ ສັນຕິພາບ ເອກະລາດ ປະຊາທິປະໄຕ ເອກະພາບ ວັດຖະນາຖາວອນ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nayok (talk • contribs) 16:45, 29 March 2008 (UTC)