Talk:Emerging adulthood and early adulthood

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 14 September 2020 and 17 December 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Auradora Lee, Kassperkin, AddieRob, Deijalyc.

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Editing initiative

An advanced course in adolescent development/developmental psychology is working on a major expansion of this article. Initial work should be completed in late October 2012. This will encompass not just Arnett's research, but become an article on normative development on the late adolescence/early adult period (approximately ages 18-30). It should include normative information on biological, social, and cognitive development. In addition, it will have information on how adulthood and the transition to adulthood is defined. We hope to bring in work from an international perspective and one sensitive to social class differences because of the wide variation in how this transition is experienced. Nancydarling (talk) 13:25, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

It seems like there should be some sort of merge between this article and the Young adult (psychology) article. Flyer22 (talk) 19:07, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Even though there is quite some overlap between both articles, emerging adulthood both starts and finished earlier than young adult. For instance, the age 30 transition and settling down of the middle and late thirties don't belong in this article. Therefore I am not in favor of a merge. Lova Falk talk 19:19, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for weighing in, Lova Falk. Like I stated on your talk page, I didn't want a merge. It was just a suggestion that maybe a merge of some sort should be done. Like a merge with a new name to go along with it. But, yeah, I'm not hard-pressed on that. As for "emerging adulthood [starting] and finish[ing] earlier than young adult," I take it that you are speaking of the age ranges given. I state that because the emerging adulthood concept deals with young adults as well; it just doesn't extend past age 26 apparently. This article states that "Emerging adulthood is a phase of the life span between adolescence and full-fledged adulthood, proposed by Jeffrey Arnett" that "primarily applies to young adults in developed countries who do not have children, do not live in their own home, or do not have sufficient income to become fully independent in their early to late 20s" and that "Jeffrey Arnett says emerging adulthood is the period between 18 and 26 years of age where adolescents become more independent and explore various life possibilities." And as the lead of the Young adult (psychology) article states, the age that one is considered a young adult varies. Despite Erik Erikson's argument that young adulthood starts at age 20, most countries consider 18 to be the start of young adulthood, legally anyway. Flyer22 (talk) 16:08, 7 October 2012 (UTC)

I had to attribute some text specifically to Arnett; things like "there are a few reasons why the term young adulthood is not fit to describe the developmental period of the late teens and early twenties" and "it is nonsensical to combine the late teenage years, twenties, and thirties together because the 18‑25 age period and the thirties are very distinct from one another" should not be written as definitive statements when they are the view of only one person or one small group. The rest of the section even currently points out that "emerging adulthood" is not a common term because late adolescents and early to mid 20-somethings are considered young adults. Flyer22 (talk) 16:40, 7 October 2012 (UTC)

I'm an editor of the Journal of Adolescence (which covers to age 25), have been in the Society for Research in Adolescence since the year of it's founding, and have published more than 50 professional articles/chapters on adolescent development and made well over 100 professional presentations on the topic, so this is an area I know a fair amount about. You are absolute right - it is hard to put a hard and fast line around the ages of adolescence and adulthood. There is also a small amount of controversy around the term 'emerging adulthood'. Nonetheless, it has become probably the most commonly used descriptor to refer to that gray area between fully dependent adolescence and the period when people take on those roles that have traditionally been associated with the transition to adulthood. Those markers include completing school, leaving the parent home, entering the workforce (for men), financial independence, marriage, and childbearing. This period has become very extended in many countries - both Western and non-Western. Cross-cultural research shows clear support for an indeterminate period when people have made some, but not all, of these transitions. This is also defined as a time when many people are relatively loosely tied to jobs, to relationships, or to fixed living arrangements. All of these things have come to be seen as defining qualities of emerging adulthood (hence the term). There is a conference on this area and a learned society (http://www.ssea.org/). It is a standard term in textbooks and journals. The idea was definitely pushed by Arnett. It is no longer defined by his work.

Erikson was a very influential theorist and clinician and has some interesting descriptive ideas. His work is not considered current in the developmental literature and I don't think he should be considered as the basis for defining an age period. The term 'young adulthood' is also used to define the period from roughly the late teen years though . . . maybe 35? That is exactly the problem, from a developmental perspective, with defining developmental periods by age. Biologically, people are adults when they can reproduce. Physically, they grow several years after that. Neurologically, you get normative growth into the 20's. Psychologically, self-identification as an adult can range over several decades and is often context specific (I might feel an adult sexually but not financially). From a sociological perspective, the assumption of adult roles is often considered definitive. You are an adult when you work, support yourself, marry, have children, etc. You can do that at age 5 or may never take on all those roles. Many papers/chapters have discussed exactly this point. But this is an encyclopedia whose goal is to provide information organized in ways that people can find it.

PERSONALLY, I would like to take this article and call it Emerging Adulthood/Early Adulthood or Emerging and Early Adulthood. 'Emerging Adulthood' is the most common way to refer to this period in the developmental psychology/adolescence literature. 'Early Adulthood' is the more traditional and still common way to refer to it in the literature on adult development and aging. I would then make the Emerging Adulthood article the basis for that article. I would take the very brief article on Young Adulthood, take the small amount of unique material in it, and redirect searches on Emerging Adulthood, Young Adulthood, Young Adult, and Early Adulthood here.

I would like if there were some examples of people and heir stories on emreging adulthood. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.123.226.226 (talk) 02:58, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

At some later date, material on the later part of young adulthood could be expanded. The latter part of this period is outside the realm of our class's work Nancydarling (talk) 19:08, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

As always, I appreciate the response, Nancy. You stated that "the idea [of emerging adulthood] was definitely pushed by Arnett. It is no longer defined by his work." I have to state that if this is the case -- that this concept is no longer defined by Arnett's work -- then this article needs WP:Reliable sources for the concept outside of Arnett's view on it. Most of the sources in the article are not using the term "emerging adulthood"; they are using "adolescence," "adulthood," "young adulthood" and "early adulthood." I didn't understand your "You can do that at age 5" comment, since 5-year-olds can't do that (except for the case of child labour or minor work such as school work or chores, child marriages...which are not the child's doing anyway, or the have-a-child part...which has only occurred with Lina Medina from what I know). I also see that you left a note at Wikipedia:WikiProject Psychology; just so you know, you aren't likely to get any replies from there. That project is very inactive. I mention, though, that I like the title Emerging and early adulthood. And merging the Young adult (psychology) article here would of course have to happen before it's redirected here. There's no reason that the material in that article should be discarded. Flyer22 (talk) 03:09, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Did you see the recent article on child brides in National Geographic that do involve girls as young as 5? That was where that was coming from. Bottom line - role transitions are culturally variable and only one aspect of the transition. Arnett is a completely reliable source - well published in scholarly circles, author of textbooks, defined and invented the term 'emerging adult'. He DID define the term. He is simply not now the only person who uses it. This piece, when we got to it, seemed to have two purposes that were not well combined. First, it defined 'emerging adulthood' as a concept introduced was by Arnett. Second, it discussed normative change that occurred during this age period. We have been transitioning this piece towards a normative development piece parallel to the piece on Adolescence. That's why I think it would be well merged with Early Adulthood. The title itself is not important to me, but having accurate information about the age period is.Nancydarling (talk) 19:18, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

No, Nancy, I didn't see that article. I was only making a point, which is of course why I referred to the Child marriage article. And I wasn't disputing that Arnett is a completely reliable source for this information or that he defined the term; I was only pointing out that if the concept -- using the term "emerging adulthood"/"emerging adult" -- has expanded beyond him, then this article needs reliable sources using the term...apart from him. Otherwise, it's only a concept attributed to him and is very WP:FRINGE. It needs other sources using the term either way...per WP:SECONDARY. As for merging the Young adult (psychology) article with this one, I was stating that because the material in that article is notable, it should not be discarded. It's not a true merge if the material is discarded; it's only a redirect. Flyer22 (talk) 20:15, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

I see that an editor moved this article to its current title -- Emerging adulthood and early adulthood. I feel that it should be changed so that the first instance of "adulthood" is not in the title. Other than that, the Young adult (psychology) article still exists. And since this article is more about early adulthood, while the Young adult (psychology) article is more about early to mid-adulthood, and the psychology that goes on with that, I'm now thinking that article should not be merged with this one. Flyer22 (talk) 20:32, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Multiple references

Please, whoever it was that put in the same reference behind each sentence, check the guideline on multiple references! Thank you! Lova Falk talk 09:49, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

And by the way, first the period sign and then the reference. Lova Falk talk 09:51, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

Changingsea.net

Currently, the entire Sexual relationships section is sourced to Changingsea.net. I have to state that I don't feel that this source counts as a WP:Reliable source and certainly not with regard to WP:MEDRS, at least not for this information. Flyer22 (talk) 19:01, 7 October 2012 (UTC)

The author of that piece - Sex in Emerging Adulthood: A Decade in the Sexual Gap - is a reputable expert in the field ("Marla E. Eisenberg is an assistant professor of general pediatrics and adolescent health in the School of Medicine and an adjunct assistant professor of epidemiology and community health in the School of Public Health at the University of Minnesota.") That article also contains a really nice annotated bibliography at the end from very good sources. HOWEVER, I agree that it would be much better to go to those original sources (from which the material in that essay came) and cite them instead of a page on Christian approaches to counselling. Especially for sexuality it undermines the credibility of the material, even if it is accurate. Nancydarling (talk) 19:28, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

I see, Nancy. I can only go by our guidelines and policies on this. Changingsea.net does not count as a WP:Reliable source and it should not be used for medical information...per WP:MEDRS, although there are sometimes exceptions if material is coming from an expert in his or her field. You appear to know about the expert-in-their-field part, but I still note that the guideline and policy pages go over this. This doesn't appear to be a case where such a source is appropriate for this material. Using the original sources would be okay, but it is better to go with secondary sources...per WP:SECONDARY. Flyer22 (talk) 03:09, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Flyer22 - we're saying the same thing in different ways because of how language is used in different fields. In psychology and other sciences, a scholar writing up a published paper in Science or Developmental Psychology is a primary source. A secondary source is a review article summarizing many scientific articles. A textbook can be a secondary or tertiary source. What I was suggesting was that the article written and published on Changingsea.net (which I agree is not what should be cited) is what I would call a secondary source and the students should cite the original research articles on which it relied. Wikipedia would call an analysis of data (the original studies) a secondary source. So we are in agreement about the substance of what you said. Nancydarling (talk) 20:10, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Yes, we're on the same page about this, Nancy. Flyer22 (talk) 20:32, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

"Young adult" photo

The "young adult" photo on the right of the article just seems so generic and unnecessary, it almost begs the question, "Why is this here?" Just strikes me as very odd when first viewing the page. G90025 (talk) 19:25, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

G90025, that image was added with this edit; I agree with you about that image, except that it doesn't strike "me as very odd when first viewing the page." Feel free to remove it. Flyer22 (talk) 19:42, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

I have removed the image. Another thing about it was that the image did not seem representative of young adults in general as the individual was wearing highly stylized clothing and the file name was "hipster.jpg" or something of that nature. Regardless, I'm pretty sure most people could recognize a young adult without needing a picture for reference. G90025 (talk) 12:25, 14 December 2013 (UTC)

This article should mostly be restricted to Arnett's concept/theories

This article should mostly be restricted to Arnett's concept/theories and those who think like him about the subject. Right now, many parts of the article are very similar to the Adolescence article, Young adult (psychology) article and other Wikipedia articles about adolescence, and a lot of the sources are about adolescence or young adulthood, not Arnett's concept/theories. We should not be housing a WP:Content fork like this. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 23:46, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

Permstrump, any ideas? Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 23:47, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

Based on the talkpage and edit summaries, I wouldn't be surprised if some of the students editing this article unintentionally put in some synthesis/original research being unfamiliar with WP's policies/guidelines. Are there specific sections you had in mind? —PermStrump(talk) 19:21, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

No, not any specific sections. The first section of the "Distinction from young adulthood and adolescence" section is mainly based on Arnett, but a lot of stuff afterward is based on sources about adolescence and/or young adulthood. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 01:33, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

Before your edit, that section was entirely about Arnett. I'm wondering whether this article should be kept and retain the stuff based on adolescent and young adult sources, or if it should mainly be about Arnett's ideas/beliefs. My point is that we already have the Adolescence article, the Young adult (psychology) article, and similar articles, for a lot of the content that this article includes. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 01:42, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

It is a bit of an afterthought, but I think a citation should be added to the final line of the introduction on why Arnett's concepts are criticized by developmental psychologists. There should also be more elaboration on what he has said in response to these criticisms, particularly the claim that he neglects other social economic classes.Auradora Lee (talk) 20:16, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

question by unsigned Thegetch1996

Would it be beneficial to add a link to Annette's ted talk? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fv8KpQY0m6o — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thegetch1996 (talk • contribs)

Updating DSM and other sources

I've noticed that the DSM cited in this article is DSM IV instead of DSM V, it could be updated with the newest, and most relevant edition and definitions. Additionally, a source needs to be cited after the sentence "The developmental theory is highly controversial within the developmental field, and developmental psychologists argue over the legitimacy of Arnett's theories and methods" in the opening paragraph. An expansion could be added in regards to the debate and why it is important as well. Tucag20 (talk) 02:05, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

Basic improvements

Hello, I am new to Wikipedia and am finding articles to edit related to adult development. This article seems to be well written, but it seems like it would be good to incorporate the diagnoses from the DSM - V as was mentioned earlier in the talk page. I also think it would be helpful to add an external link to the TED talk given by Jeffrey Arnett entitled " Why does it take so long to grow up today?" given in 2015. I also think it would be helpful to add more up to date sources as it relates to the numbers of people in college, getting married, having kids, etc.. That will give us a clearer picture of Arnett's theory in a current context. Lastly, since this page is nothing but words, it might be good to add a picture of Arnett, so the reader can see who they are learning about. I know a picture was deleted previously, but at least one might be good. What do you all think about the ideas I have presented? Funkd2019 (talk) 03:35, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

Hello, I think that adding a photo or two to this article could improve some of the reader's ability to comprehend the article. If a photo is hard to find, including a figure depicting some of the statistics included in this article could be beneficial. I also think that a change in the title could increase the professionalism. Instead of Emerging adulthood and early adulthood it could just be "emerging adulthood" or "emerging adulthood- adolescent or adult?". Those are just a few basic improvement ideas. Adkpenni (talk) 14:59, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

I agree that a title change could be beneficial. It is repetitive as it currently is. Photos would also be good and help with understanding. Kay Grifin (talk) 19:28, 1 October 2024 (UTC)

Minor edits for sentence flow

Hello! I just tweaked the introduction a bit to make the sentences flow better. Any feedback is welcome and appreciated! Sydneyboyack (talk) 20:43, 9 March 2021 (UTC)

History Behind Emerging Adulthood

Although this section is quite interesting I feel that there needs to be more sources added to back up the connection of these events to emerging adulthood. Right now it seems to be more thoughts and opinions and less facts. Does anyone have any sources that can back these claims up more? Thanks Hoveyk (talk) 21:22, 3 May 2021 (UTC)

Hello! I've been able to find a few sources that may help expand these sections and become more fact-centered. Let me know if there's more I should add. Thanks! Jorabbit0715 (talk) 20:29, 15 March 2024 (UTC)

Source for Shuman

There is not a source for the Shuman information. I was not able to find any research on this topic from Shuman. Wondering if we should take out this part? MandyGuymon312 (talk) 00:42, 22 June 2021 (UTC)

Some more basic improvements

I'm also new to Wikipedia, like someone else said they were above, and I'm looking into articles related to adult development that could be improved. I think this article has a really great foundation, but there are a few things I think could be improved. First, the lead could be better organized to follow the organization of the rest of the article. I think this would help the flow of the article a lot. For me, it was a bit confusing on whether or not the article was specifically about Arnett's theories about emerging adulthood or emerging adulthood in general. I know that Arnett coined the term "emerging adulthood", but I'm sure there are other people who have contributed to the topic that could be mentioned more. Lastly, the history section could be expanded upon and more clearly linked to emerging adulthood, as someone else had mentioned before. Any thoughts or ideas for the things I've mentioned? Sarahn98 (talk) 00:28, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

I'm also new to Wikipedia and looking into articles related to adult development that could be improved. Overall, this article is well-developed and well written. There are just a couple things that I think could improve the article. Adding an image and changing the name of the article to something more concise would be helpful. In addition, Some of the references talk about adolescence so checking in on those and making sure they are applying more to emerging adulthood than to adolescence would help make the statements more accurate. There also should be a reference for the Women’s movement part of history. Lastly, it clearly explains Arnett’s theory, but it might be beneficial to expound on emerging adulthood to more information than just Arnett’s theory. Madimiddledorf (talk) 04:28, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development Spring 2022

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 18 April 2022 and 18 July 2022. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): AriannaLarson (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by AriannaLarson (talk) 19:20, 18 July 2022 (UTC)

Why is this distinct from young adulthood?

Not a criticism of the article, it's perfectly fine and describes Arnett's theories, but doesn't emerging adulthood imply it is indeed a stage of adulthood? 'Emerging adults'? You're still calling using the term adults anyway, implying adulthood has been reached. 18-34

Also, considering Arnett also considers 30-45 to be 'established' adulthood, why not just make a page for Arnett's theories of adulthood? They're more of an alternative view/perspective than part of the mainstream view, and this should be remedied. Schwarbage (talk) 15:27, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

Lack of "post-adolescence" disambig article

Not sure if the presence of the redirect hatnote for "post-adolescence" makes sense if there aren't going to be any meaningful suggestions of directing users elsewhere. I am not an expert on the subject myself, but I would probably find a topic and their respective article(s) that relates closely to transitioning to adulthood. Qwertyxp2000 (talk | contribs) 03:15, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development Winter 2023

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 4 January 2023 and 3 April 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Stephanie.merrick.wright (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Stephanie.merrick.wright (talk) 06:45, 5 April 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Developmental Psychology

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 21 February 2023 and 12 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Larie.exe (article contribs). Peer reviewers: Emma0513.

— Assignment last updated by Explorepsych (talk) 02:49, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

Hi there, I like where this article heading, there is a solid foundation of information and sources. However, some aspects need additional information and elaboration- I would like to review the criticism section as well as the lead to better help the reader understand the layout of the article. Hlsmoot (talk) 16:04, 3 May 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development Spring 2023

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 April 2023 and 17 July 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): CDSFortin (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by CDSFortin (talk) 16:48, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Adult Development Fall 2023

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 11 September 2023 and 11 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Tsuki2023 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Charliejo99 (talk) 08:33, 15 November 2023 (UTC)

Adding Images

This article would benefit from having additional images added. The only image present is an odd image that seems to be misplaced and not at all related to the topic. The lead section's graphic can aid in drawing the reader in. The people, objects, activities, and ideas that are discussed in the article can also be accurately and directly depicted in the photographs. They will demonstrate the authors' true intentions. Long text passages can become more visually appealing and easy to read with the help of the visuals. Kailey Stokes (talk) 03:27, 2 October 2024 (UTC)

I believe the article on 'Emerging Adulthood and Early Adulthood' does a great job of explaining the idea and how it works. It talks about important theories, like Jeffrey Arnett's, and different topics, like relationships, education, and cultural factors. However, the piece could be better if it included more cultural points of view, especially those that show how becoming an adult might be different in non-Western countries. Adding pictures or graphs could also help people understand the topic better and picture it in their minds. The article is good and full of useful information as a whole, but these changes could make it even better.Spotynaty (talk) 05:59, 2 October 2024 (UTC)