Talk:Flag of Northern Ireland

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Current use of the flag on Wikipedia

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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I am aware that this topic has been raised in the past regarding the status of the flag, but I feel that the usage of the Ulster Banner on Wikipedia should be addressed. Given that Northern Ireland does not have a flag that represents itself, should we really be using the Ulster Banner to represent Northern Ireland? I propose that we remove the flag from the template {{NIR}} or else replace it with the Union Jack, which is legally the only flag that represents Northern Ireland. Articles such as the Commonwealth Games and List of FIFA country codes use the UB to represent NI – but we ought to remember that the encyclopaedia is supposed to be accurate and neutral, and we should not use the flag to mirror sporting tournaments because that would be entirely erroneous and misleading. st170e 17:57, 4 February 2018 (UTC)

As stated at WT:IE, I think this should be moved to WT:IMOS. It's not of direct relevance to the Flag of Northern Ireland article. Scolaire (talk) 14:28, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

The flag is used by a large number of the Northern Irish population outside of sporting events and is used for other things. I even have a nice photo taken in Dublin airport of an Irish made souvenir that states Northern Ireland and uses the Ulster Banner to represent it. In all places as well. Shucks. Mabuska ^(talk) 15:37, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Alright, I'll move this to IMOS – I was going through the archives of WT Flag Template and they said it was the wrong venue and to post here instead. st170e 17:48, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I've moved the discussion to Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Ireland-related articles#Current use of the Ulster Banner on Wikipedia. st170e 17:56, 8 February 2018 (UTC)

Citation update

There has been a request for a citation of the first sentence for nearly a year, I think.

The lede sentence suggests that the only "official" flag of Northern Ireland is the Union Jack.

Clearly, however, this is rubbish: the Union Jack is the flag of the UK, and cannot therefore be distinguished as the flag of Northern Ireland as well.

While the flag of Northern Ireland is the only flag of Northern Ireland, and the only one that identifies Northern Ireland specifically, that is not my point.

To be clear, my point is simply that the first sentence is completely incorrect.

I intend to change the first paragraph to remove that sentence, and to make mention of the common name for the flag ("flag of Northern Ireland").

Two points:

• The Union Jack is only used by government officials during official visits to Northern Ireland: it is not used to actually represent Northern Ireland. It is used to represent official UK business.

• The flag of Northern Ireland is commonly referred to as "the Northern Irish flag" or "flag of Northern Ireland". It is much more rarely referred to as the "Ulster flag" or the "Ulster banner". Of course, recently with the popularity of the Internet and discussion about the flag, the use of the word "banner" to describe the flag has increased. The banner is the actual banner on the coat of arms, from which the flag came to be. --75.177.79.101 (talk) 08:35, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

You need to refer to prior discussions and find citation support, Given the controversy over this you also need talk page agreement before making any changes -----Snowded ^TALK 12:32, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

In agreement with Snowded. Best you get support here at the talk-page, first. Otherwise, you'll only be making changes that will get reverted. GoodDay (talk) 02:03, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Which is why I've started this discussion.

To that end then, do either or both of you agree that the Union Jack is not the flag of Northern Ireland? --75.177.79.101 (talk) 06:24, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Look at the above section, this item is closed on this page, there is one place to have the discussion, Further any discussion is not about the opinion of editors but has to be based on sourced material. -----Snowded ^TALK 06:29, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Not up to me, but I'd argue that Northern Ireland has no flag. GoodDay (talk) 10:37, 10 February 2018 (UTC)

Flag of Northern Ireland

The first sentence of this article is completely incorrect. The Union Jack is not the flag of Northern Ireland. It is the flag of the United Kingdom. The Union Jack is also not the flag of England. The flag is only the flag of England insofar as England is a part of the United Kingdom. The same with Northern Ireland. There is no legislation that I'm aware of that suggests that the flag of Northern Ireland is the Union Jack, other than as a part of the United Kingdom. I think Wikipedia has a policy against Original Research? Can we have this fixed? --82.2.5.153 (talk) 02:43, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

It is not original research, it is what reliable sources say. The first four citations for the article say that. The Northern Ireland Office said that. Wikipedia is based on reliable sources not on logic. You'd have to produce an even better reliable source saying otherwise. Dmcq (talk) 08:41, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Clarification request regarding the discretionary sanction applying to this article

I have initiated a clarification request regarding the scope of the discretionary sanctions applying to this article: Please review the request at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment#Clarification request: The Troubles and, if you wish to do so, enter your statement and any other material you wish to submit to the Arbitration Committee. Additionally, the Wikipedia:Arbitration guide may be of use. Thryduulf (talk) 17:22, 15 January 2019 (UTC)

Flag of Europe

Since the United Kingdom has left the European Union, I don't believe they fly the flag of Europe anymore. I don't have sources for my assumption, but it seems pretty obvious to me that they wouldn't use it anymore. -- Isidor Welti (talk) 17:41, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Flag of the Police Service of Northern Ireland.png

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 20:37, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

Proposed merge of Northern Ireland flags issue into Flag of Northern Ireland

Possible POV fork. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 07:17, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose. Northern Ireland flags issue was created in February 2006. If it was a POV fork, don't you think somebody would have noticed before now? Besides, what POV do you think it's trying to push? 11:27, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
• Oppose Obvious PoV proposal to imply something exists when it doesn't-----Snowded ^TALK 14:49, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

  There doesn't seem to be much content covered in one article that is not present in the other, although from the history I see that they used to be more distinct. - CHAMPION ^{(talk) (contributions) (logs)} 01:54, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

  The meat of the "Flags issue" article is in the Controversies section; that is not duplicated in this article. Unfortunately, it is dwarfed by the quite unnecessary mass of images and text describing the flags, which can readily be found in this article or List of flags used in Northern Ireland. The Flag proposals section does not need to be in both articles in full. I would recommend keeping it here and providing a very brief summary in the "Flags issue" article. Scolaire (talk) 15:12, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

• Merge in the other direction - Both articles do indeed cover the same content. However, since there's no accepted flag of Northern Ireland, it makes more sense for the article that discusses it to be the Northern Ireland flags issue one, since that is what the actual article is about. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C4:6B13:D801:88F1:DF0:8A57:E814 (talk) 22:57, 23 June 2024 (UTC)