Talk:Gunpowder tea

How is tea rolled into balls?

It should be explained how gunpowder tea leaves are rolled; supposedly this is done leaf by leaf, by hand. Badagnani 20:21, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Not really sure about the machine but you roll it like you would balls of clay by hand. Sjschen 21:43, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Somewhere I read that most brands claim it's hand-rolled but that most commercially produced is done by machine. We should dig and find out exactly how this is done. It would be great to have a photo of somebody doing this! Badagnani 22:15, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Gunpowder is so far I know not rolled by hand, this seems to be one of those urban legends that have spread widely. The shape of the tea originates from the method of stopping the process of fermentation. This is traditionally done in a rotating barrel which is filled with the pure tea and installed above a fire. By the way that technique is also the reason for the mild roast aroma that Gunpowder Tea is quite famous for. However, these days also the (originally) Japanese method of steaming the tea to stop the fermentation is widely used in China – Those Gunpowder Teas do lack that roast aroma but still get their form from that rotating barrel which is then steamed. Furthermore also these barrels get replaced by specialized rolling machines (Have a look here: [1]).

Hope that explains a little, unfortunately I have no good (english) sources for these claims. --Soultea (talk) 15:25, 30 November 2012 (UTC)

Stopping fermentation is done by various methods (see Tea processing), but I think the final form has more to do with the needs storage and transport. The teas used to be rolled by hand in small operations. However, later it started to be put into fabric bags and then kneaded by the hands and heels of workers. Now there are machines to do the job [2] -- Sjschen (talk) 01:11, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

Form or shape

I think the original wording "a form of tea" is better than "a shape of tea," which doesn't sound right. It's made clear that it could be made from green or oolong in the next sentence. Also, outside China I think what is sold as "gunpowder tea" must almost always be green tea, not oolong. Thus, the English name "gunpowder tea" should refer just to the green variety, but the Chinese name would be understood as referring to either, I think. Correct me if I'm wrong. If so, this distinction should be clarified in the article as well. Badagnani 10:56, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed with "form of tea", "shape" sounds strange. However I disagree that gunpowder teas(GPT) available in the Western world is just green. It may be that in the past Western GPTs were mainly green teas, but since 10 years ago I have seen both green and oolong teas in GPT form form both online and in physical shops in LA and Vancouver. Zhucha in Chinese really just refers to the shape of the tea just like bingcha or zhuancha for pu-erh tea shape, namely, it tells something about the preservation ability of the tea but little about the type of tea itself. That being said I'll go easier on the emphasis regarding this matter. Sjschen 21:43, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Really? I've never seen oolong gunpowder in the U.S. How is it labeled? Most of the cheap brands just call it "gunpowder tea" instead of "gunpowder green tea." Regarding the "normal" kind of gunpowder green tea, which specific green tea variety is most common? It usually has a vibrant green color, almost like wakame seaweed, and the leaves are long and feathery. Badagnani 22:18, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure there is a variety of "normal" gunpowder tea. Rolling the tea into gunpowder form is a final processing step prior to drying and teas of any variety and region can be rolled into this form. Perhaps I was confused, but I've seen both the terms "gunpowder" and 珠茶 used for oolong teas. But then again, they were most likely referring to the form of the tea, and not likely the Zhejiang teas in which the name "gunpowder tea" was given. An iteresting note is that some of the lighter gunpowder form oolong teas taste surprisingly like zhejiang gunpowder tea. Sjschen 00:19, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Maybe this is one of those issues that are name versus form. Sjschen 00:23, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I guess I meant the predominant brands that are most widely available at an inexpensive price in North America. Like this one, this one, this one, and this one. I think some of these might be PRC government industries, and some of the brands may have a common supplier or group of suppliers in the same region. This is the one I've got right now; it's organic fair trade from Mountain Rose Herbs. Badagnani 00:29, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm starting to think I am mistaken. The shape of gunpowder tea can be applied to many type of tea from many regions. However, the name of "gunpowder tea" and "珠茶" in more industry related sources appears to apply only to green teas that have been rolled that were made in Zhejiang province. From the chinese sites, the name "gunpowder tea" is only applied to the rolled green tea "pingshui gunpowder tea"(平水珠茶) from a place south of shaoxing. That being said, I'm wondering if rolled green teas produced in other locations can be called gunpowder tea. Sjschen 00:48, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

It would seem that with such a longstanding and well known product that there would be websites that would spell all this out. But I'm not really certain that most (or any) gunpowder tea packages actually tell where the growing region or processing factory is located. We can check the next time we visit an Asian store to see if there's any location listed on the package. I don't know if "Temple of Heaven" is a style or just a brand name. Also, it seems to be produced also in Taiwan. I notice you added Tiguanyin; isn't that an oolong? Badagnani 04:36, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm sure they will only mention at most that they were manufactured in zhejiang. I put Tieguanyin because though it is not "gunpowder tea", it is often rolled into the gunpowder form.Sjschen 16:42, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I'm also starting to think that this article, even before my input, had the object shape versus product name problem. Taiwan does not have a zhucha, it does has a zhu-lu-cha or a "long-zhu-cha", however both are not being referred directly as zhucha. Keelung is also not known for "zhucha". "Temple of heaven" appears to be a brand gone variety, zhongcha produced a "heaven brand" but since then the name has been applied to the gunpowder tea sold by various vendors. Like most chinese teas names this one also appears to be a huge mess. Sjschen 17:06, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Do you know when "Temple of Heaven" was a brand of tea? I've always known it to be a variety of gunpowder tea, and while I haven't been drinking it all that long, I learned about it (as a variety, not a brand) because of someone whose tea of choice it was a number of decades ago. -Erik Harris 18:11, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Or it could have been a variety turned brand, who knows? When you buy the zhongcha label gunpowder tea, you will see that it says "Temple of Heaven" on the English side. But on the Chinese since it will say "天壇牌" which literally means "heavenly altar/hall brand" indicating (to me) that it may not be a variety. But then again maybe it is a variety turn brand or brand turned variety, or anywhere in between. From this site (Chinese) it indicates that the tea is known as pingshui zhu tea(平水珠茶) and was presented at some internation food fair thing in Madrid 1984 as "temple of heaven" where it won a gold medal. I guessing the name/brand/variety stuck from then on. Sjschen 18:46, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Adding Sources

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Production in Taiwan?

I never heard of any modern production around Keelung, or indeed anywhere in Taiwan. A quick Google search found some course materials by an NTU AgEcon professor, which says Taiwanese gunpowder tea had a monopoly in the Middle East and North Africa, but started to fade away around 1950s, though no mention of whether it's still produced today. I suspect whoever wrote this confused Muzha and Shimen tieguanyin with gunpowder. While the shapes are similar, Taiwanese tieguanyin is a descendent of Mainland tieguanyin and should not be included here. C9mVio9JRy (talk) 20:46, 26 June 2021 (UTC)