Talk:Hajji Mohammad Hossein Isfahani

"Hajji"

@LouisAragon: Hajji is a title given to those who complete the Hajj. Is it proper to include it in the article title? --‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia ^ᐐT₳LKᐬ 21:22, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Yes, it's part of many Iranian names during the Qajar era. The Cambridge History of Iran calls him 'Hajji Mohammad Hossein Isfahani/Khan', hence why I moved the name of the article, which you randomly moved back. If I'm not mistaken, 'hajji' was like 'sir' back then in Iran. --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:50, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Seems HistoryofIran beat me to it. Yeah, its proper to include it. - LouisAragon (talk) 22:58, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

@LouisAragon and HistoryofIran:"Sir" is not included in the title of articles. That's the point - titles are not included in titles, per MOS:HONORIFIC ‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia ^ᐐT₳LKᐬ 23:03, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Further, I for one cannot find any examples of existing articles which contain "Hajji" as a title. Except for a fictional character ‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia ^ᐐT₳LKᐬ 23:08, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Would more say that it was part of his name than a honorific title. Academic sources such as Iranica and Cambridge History of Iran have no problem in using 'Hajji', I don't think we should either. --HistoryofIran (talk) 23:10, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

It's not a question on including it in the lead sentence, it's a question of whether to include it in the title - and titles should comply with WP guidelines. Is it a title or is it his name? That's the only issue, in my view. There's no reason to start a new precedent of including honorific titles when no other article on WP includes "Hajji." ‡ Єl Cid of ᐺalencia ^ᐐT₳LKᐬ 23:13, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

Was about to say, I found a few with the name 'Hajji', such as Haj Ali Razmara, Haji Bektash Veli and Hajji Ebrahim Shirazi, but it's not really important whether zero or fifteen Wikipedia articles have a article starting with 'Hajji' in order to have the name of this article approved. As I said, 'Hajji' is more part of a name than a honorific title, in Persian at least. Take the Haji Alilu tribe, for example. --HistoryofIran (talk) 23:10, 20 July 2018 (UTC)

"Hajji" was a common part of many Iranian names in the past. It was not just a "honorific" as in the classical sense.

• "(...) I for one cannot find any examples of existing articles which contain "Hajji" as a title."

A quick look shows numerous articles; Hajji Beg, Khan of Ganja, Hajji Piri, Hajji Beg. All of them covered by WP:RS sources.

- LouisAragon (talk) 23:25, 20 July 2018 (UTC)