Talk:Henry Davis Sleeper

Sleeper's sexuality

Can anyone provide a primary source whereby Sleeper identifies himself as gay- or is identified as gay by a family member, neighbor, close personal friend, and/or associate that would have been privy to such information? Until the direct quotation of a primary source is provided this asssertion remains speculative at best, and leaves this article vulnerable to the accusation that it is not a factual study of the man but rather, mere opinion/speculation. (Please note: this article has been rated as C-Class in the WikiProject LGBT studies project, an indication as to how weak the arguments being laid down truly are. If scholarship is to stand the test of time, its arguemnts must be supported by actual facts, not wishes, hopes, and dreams... No matter how well-intentioned.) William Oxford Orwigg (talk) 11:53, 5 August 2022 (UTC)

• "Identifying" as gay is kind of an impossible thing to ask of a man who lived a century ago in a very repressive world with a different language for these matters. One of the sources notes that there is evidence in his letters for the "intensity of his feelings" for A. Piatt Andrew. So no, that he was most likely a gay man seems to be confirmed by the sources, and that's really the end of it. Drmies (talk) 22:11, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
  • The source Drmies linked also cites two books; Beauport Chronicle: The Intimate Letters of Henry Davis Sleeper to Abram Piatt Andrew, Jr., 1906-1915 and The Art of Scandal: The Life and Times of Isabella Stewart Gardner. Unfortunately I don't have access to either source. The first appears to be a collection of Sleeper's letters. The second, based on a review in the New England Quarterly, may be useful however.
  • I also came across this review/article (not sure which), published in the Journal of American History in 2016, which has the following sentence of interest Without a direct source, the interpretive planners did not incorporate Sleeper’s sexuality into the tour until a descendant came forward and provided an oral history of Sleeper as a gay man. as part of a broader paragraph on how some of Sleeper's documentation was not saved under the possibility of safeguarding part of his personal life. Sideswipe9th (talk) 23:02, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
    • Sideswipe9th, I looked at those books too, and it's a shame they're not accessible. Drmies (talk) 14:56, 9 August 2022 (UTC)

• While we should probably not be saying "Sleeper was gay" in wikivoice, I don't see the issue in acknowledging the findings of historians and other scholars regarding the sexuality of the subject. I've also undone one of the edits to the last paragraph of the section "Personal life", as it seemed WP:POINTy and unencyclopedic. Isabelle ^🏳‍🌈 22:56, 7 August 2022 (UTC)
  • User:Isabelle Belato, I completely agree with your edit, though I assume that with "previous edit" you meant "previous version". I looked at that phrase too but couldn't read the Boston Globe article; I should have done the right thing and made the change that you made. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 14:56, 9 August 2022 (UTC)