Talk:Highway of Tears

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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 7 January 2019 and 19 April 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Mr.wrightnow16.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 22:21, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

error!

It says Maureen Mosie was found 16 miles east of kamloops, which is NOT on this highway or even near it. In fact many of these are not on highway 16 between Prince George and Prince Rupert. Shelly Ann Bascu.

This was likely due to the fact that these victims were on the E-Pana list created by the RCMP to originally resolve Highway of Tears cases, but later evolved to other BC highways cases, including Mosie and Bascu. These victims have been subsequently added to a new page, E-Pana, and removed from this page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nfox24 (talk • contribs) 07:38, 3 December 2018 (UTC)

Eventual merge

So, if it turns out that Bobby Jack Fowler committed all (well, most) of these murders, I would say that it doesn't make sense to have this article, and it should instead be part of Fowler's article. Obviously we don't have this confirmation yet, but I'm just thinking ahead here. Ego White Tray (talk) 12:28, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Well, this guy is a serial killer whose victims include others as well, so I would think we should keep a standalone article on him. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 12:35, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, I read too fast. Both subject pass GNG and are distinct with wide coverage. So again, I think keep separate. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 12:39, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Never mind, looks like I jumped the gun. A found a source stating that investigators don't think a single person is responsible, so best to keep separate. Ego White Tray (talk) 21:41, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Shekon! Respecting EGO White Tray, this topic is needed, another voice. Added link to your topic. http://www.ammsa.com/content/missing-and-murdered-indigenous-women-and-girls has a victim count over 1,200 now, 2016. Remember, Clifford Olson was working with, excited 2 other BC Lower Mainland serial killers, each of them equally violent, though more directly targeting American women, and all of them Eurocentric colonists... Added Human Monoculture to your Wiki, with discussion of England's Imperial policy as neocolonialism. 2016 Brexit is going to make our life worse, with England hit by over 12 trillion € debt, 820 billion € interest per annum, expect more violent resource theft. Other American related topic. Kenyan president across snake line about to be replaced by another English aristocrat, but at least a woman, maybe stop their Highway genocide now? Nip it in the bud. Nose to Her wind. Be strong. Wado! Greetings, Thanks and Love (talk) 13:51, 21 September 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

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Factual errors

The list of murders is factually wrong based on geography. Kamloops, Merritt and Williams Lake are literally hundreds of kilometres away from Hwy 16. Someone needs to either check a map or the intro to this article needs to be amended to indicate that "Highway of Tears" is a catch-all for unsolved murders along North-Central BC highways that include 5 and 97, not just the Yellowhead. 96.51.188.175 (talk) 01:10, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Highway of Tears is not a catch-all and the list of murders has been updated with the victims removed not related to the section of highway 16 between Prince Rupert and Prince George. All victims that were removed from this list were added to the wiki article E-Pana. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nfox24 (talk • contribs) 04:09, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

External links modified

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Requested move 3 December 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved to alt proposal (closed by non-admin page mover) SITH (talk) 20:15, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

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Highway of Tears murders → Highway of Tears cases – Not all Highway of Tears cases are murders as the current title could suggest; however "Highway of Tears Murdered and Missing", although accurate, is cludgy and not as streamlined as "Highway of Tears cases". Nfox24 (talk) 04:51, 3 December 2018 (UTC)--Relisting. Dekimasuよ! 01:22, 11 December 2018 (UTC) --Relisting. Steel1943 (talk) 19:30, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose "Cases" should not be capitalised. If the article is to be renamed it should be Highway of Tears murders → Highway of Tears cases. Further, a quick review of the article suggests all the cases are described as "homicide" or "missing". If these are all presumed murders by authorities, the current title may be reasonable. Sentences such as "Investigators are doubtful that they will ever solve all of the murders" (referring to all cases) seem to support this interpretation. MegaSloth (talk) 11:50, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

• Lower case "c", agreed. Keeping as "Highway of Tears murders", disagreed. Cannot make a presumption (murder) upon a presumption (authorities assuming murder). Needs to be a more accurate title, such as "Highway of Tears cases" Nfox24 (talk) 03:37, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

• Note in edits beetween 03:37 and 03:51, 6 December 2018 @Nfox24 altered the move request from Highway of Tears murders → Highway of Tears Cases to Highway of Tears murders → Highway of Tears cases, with no warnings or indications that this was done. I'm sure there was no malice intended, but modifying requests without a clear audit trail visible on the page itself, in the middle of a debate is not helpful and is against guidelines. WP:REDACT says in part: "if anyone has already replied to or quoted your original comment, changing your comment may deprive any replies of their original context, and this should be avoided". I'm quite certain that this is not the case here, but doing this could be interpreted as disingenuous or even deceitful. It should be avoided. MegaSloth (talk) 09:18, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

• @MegaSloth, you're correct, no malice intended. thanks for clearing up.Nfox24 (talk) 02:53, 7 December 2018 (UTC)

• Support Highway of Tears cases. We need to be careful with the term murder in maintaining WP:NPOV when nobody has been convicted of that crime. Only a court can decide if a homicide was a murder. Indefatigable (talk) 20:25, 11 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support move to Highway of Tears instead. That is the original title anyway; was moved because "this article is about the murders and not the highway"; but there is no highway called "Highway of Tears"- the term refers not to a highway but to a series of cases on a section of British Columbia Highway 16. Ribbet32 (talk) 00:05, 12 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support Highway of Tears. Seems to be the WP:COMMONNAME and does not inaccurately suggest that all the cases have been murders specifically.--Cúchullain ^t/c 16:23, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support Highway of Tears Indigenous girl (talk) 20:39, 19 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support Highway of Tears. No need for anything else. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:54, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support Highway of Tears. It is called the highway of tears because of the murders and disappearances. עם ישראל חי (talk) 17:56, 20 December 2018 (UTC)
• Support Highway of Tears.50.69.217.97 (talk) 15:04, 22 December 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Talk of "Lead section to Short"

Please help. I am not quite sure how to properly discuss this in the Talk page: "This article's lead section does not adequately summarize key points of its contents."

Should I just propose a new lead section paragraph here? Or suggest additional points? Help Nfox24 (talk) 19:47, 11 January 2019 (UTC)

Updated lead section to the following. Looking for feedback.

The Highway of Tears is a series of murders and disappearances along a 720-kilometre (450 mi) corridor of Highway 16 between Prince George and Prince Rupert, British Columbia, Canada, from 1970 until present. The phrase was coined in 1998 during a vigil held in Terrace, British Columbia for six missing women. There are a disproportionately high number of Indigenous women in the list of Highway of Tears victims. Explanations for this include systemic racism, poverty, drugs, violence, disconnection with traditional culture and disruption of the family unit through the foster care system and residential schools

NigelFox 17:53, 22 January 2019 (UTC)

Hello! I think it would be beneficially to add the lack of transportation systems between these towns along this stretch of highway. Diederich m (talk) 01:07, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

• Highway of Tears.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 15:38, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

Perpetrators feel a sense of "privacy"?

What does the article mean when it mentions that perpetrators feel a sense of "privacy"? 208.59.132.152 (talk) 22:04, 14 July 2020 (UTC)

@talk this was the best way to describe it. IMO, living here for 30 years, and researching HoT pretty intensely for 3 years, privacy is the primary factor for the high rate of murders/disappearances, where killers/kidnappers can be with their victims and not be seen by anyone else. It's really that simple. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nfox24 (talk • contribs) 15:39, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

article name

wouldn't it be more appropriate to call it "highway of death"? seeing so many people die here... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pyromania153 (talk • contribs) 19:16, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

87% of indigenous murder victims are killed by indigenous murderers.

can we stop perpetrating this myth that we are still looking into why this happens. We know EXACTLY wait demographic causes this. men are 10 times more likely to be in prison for murder if they're indigenous, even with gladue laws giving them lighter sentencing.

199.119.235.215 (talk) 12:37, 21 June 2024 (UTC)

All attempts have been made in this article to avoid sweeping language without reference or bias. This statement is confusing because are you saying that the other murderers don't get caught? Are you saying that 10 out of 11 men in prison for murder are indigenous? Are you saying that indigenous men are 10 times more likely across their demographic group to be in prison for murder?

Don't get me wrong, I tend to agree that victims are more likely to be killed by someone they know and someone they are like; I just don't think the references exist in the public domain that accurately define ancestry in the victims list let alone start making claims about the attackers' ancestry along the Highway of Tears. There's no concise basis for adding claims about ancestry of victims or attackers as a whole in this Wikipedia article. Nfox24 (talk) 19:23, 21 June 2024 (UTC)