Talk:His Majesty's Government (term)
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Untitled
editSee also Talk:Government of the United Kingdom for UK-specific items moved there.
I am just wondering if the article is correct when it says ", the term "His Wanka Government" was originally only used by the Imperial Government in London." is this correct or is it vandalism. (not trying to insult anyone or anything. 20:20, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
Actual description of UK government missing
editAs mentioned by Instantnood at Talk:Government of the United Kingdom, Government of the United Kingdom is not a page actually describing the UK government. Instead, it redirects here. This page, in turn, only describes the term "Her Majesty's Government".
I think Government of the United Kingdom or Her Majesty's Government should be changed into a page actually describing the government of the UK. Another possibility is redirecting Government of the United Kingdom to Politics of the United Kingdom, but this is inferior, as politics and government are related but not the same thing. Superm401 - Talk 03:03, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
- Agreed. I think that the term in most common usage in the real world (and thus the term Wikipedia should have the article at) is UK Government. That page ought to actually describe the government of the UK (ie. the one lead by Gordon Brown, headqueartered at 10 Downing St, and in charge of Whitehall). However, at Politics of the United Kingdom, we ought to describe the governance of the UK, which is not the same thing. --Mais oui! (talk) 06:15, 2 June 2009 (UTC)
- Inside the UK the term most often used is "the Government" as in "The Government's position ..." but any time that one has contact with the government at a formal level it is always Her Majesty's Government. eg Her Majesty's Government, Passport, and no-one's favourite HM Revenue and Customs, so under National varieties of English, the Government of the UK should be under this title. --PBS (talk) 09:21, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
- Really? The title of this page has always kind of bothered me. There are several queens in the world who have governments. It seems to me to be evidence of systemic bias that we have one of them here. But you don't need to take me that seriously; I've never brought this up before because I know proposing a change would elicit negative response. Dekimasuよ! 14:37, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
- It is the Royal Navy and the Royal Netherlands Navy, British sources are always going to make similar distinctions and this comes under National varieties of English. -- 15:31, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
- It's not really a question of spelling or grammar, which are covered under national varieties, but rather of maintaining a neutral point of view. I understand that this is the most common way to refer to the government described here. "President" is the most common way to refer to the President of the United States, and is also likely to be the most common use of the term overall when American sources are taken into account, but we'd never put the article on the U.S. president at President. Dekimasuよ! 03:50, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
- There is nothing wrong with a systematic bias in favor of the English language. Can you find evidence that the term "Her Majesty's Government" is ever used in English to refer to the Dutch or Danish government? (Or, for that matter, the Canadian or Antiguan ones?) john k (talk) 04:54, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
- It's not really a question of spelling or grammar, which are covered under national varieties, but rather of maintaining a neutral point of view. I understand that this is the most common way to refer to the government described here. "President" is the most common way to refer to the President of the United States, and is also likely to be the most common use of the term overall when American sources are taken into account, but we'd never put the article on the U.S. president at President. Dekimasuよ! 03:50, 30 June 2009 (UTC)
- It is the Royal Navy and the Royal Netherlands Navy, British sources are always going to make similar distinctions and this comes under National varieties of English. -- 15:31, 29 June 2009 (UTC)
- Really? The title of this page has always kind of bothered me. There are several queens in the world who have governments. It seems to me to be evidence of systemic bias that we have one of them here. But you don't need to take me that seriously; I've never brought this up before because I know proposing a change would elicit negative response. Dekimasuよ! 14:37, 26 June 2009 (UTC)
Usage of the term Her Majesty's Government
editI believe it should redirect to the Government of the United Kingdom even outside the UK it is far more associated with the British Government than any of the other Commonwealth realms who all have adapted the formant Government of foo just do a Google search all the results relate to the UK I gave up after 10 pages trying to find someone relating to another government.--Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 06:14, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- Well, there are sources in this article that illustrate how the term is used outside of Britain; I know that it is sometimes (though, admittedly, infrequently) used in Canada in relation to the federal government. Besides, should we not take a top down approach here and link first to the term and then to its various uses, rather than to one of its uses and then to the more general term? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 06:21, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- It would be giving WP:UNDUEWEIGHT to the usage of the term in other countries where it very rarely used, as opposed to the UK where it is frequently used--Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 06:39, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- I oppose the proposed redirect, this should remain an article describing the term whilst linking at the top of the page to government of the UK. There is no reason to change this setup. BritishWatcher (talk) 09:58, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- I think we're talking about the redirect at Her Majesty's Government; whether it should point to Government of the United Kingdom or to Her Majesty's Government (term). That said, I wonder about Barryrob's claim that "Her Majesty's Government" is used so frequently in the United Kingdom that it justifies that country's "ownership" of the term on Wikipedia, or even whether it's important to us or not where the term is most used. Putting the former aside for now, I'll ask again what wasn't answered before: is it really best for users that we direct them first to a selected specific use and then to the general application, or first to the general use and then to whatever specific they're looking for? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 13:47, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- Its not the general use of the term though, in the past perhaps but all the other commonwealth realms now use the term Government of foo, just have a look at the incoming links to the HMG page [1] nearly every single one is relating to the UK gov making it the primary topic the page should be redirected with a hat note linking to the term. --Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 16:09, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- The intra-Wiki links don't mean terribly much; many of them were through templates, and many others have nothing to do with the UK government. Instead of being UK-centric, I'm trying to look at this from a global point of view: will people in South Africa or the US looking for information on the government of the UK really by typing in "Her Majesty's Government" as their initial search? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 17:12, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- Yes because that is the term that is used for the UK Government [2] [3] [4] [5] it is clearly the primary topic.
- Nobody has argued that is isn't the term used for the UK government. The point is, it isn't a term only used for the UK government and it doesn't primarily refer to the British government outside of Britain. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 04:30, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
- Yes because that is the term that is used for the UK Government [2] [3] [4] [5] it is clearly the primary topic.
- The intra-Wiki links don't mean terribly much; many of them were through templates, and many others have nothing to do with the UK government. Instead of being UK-centric, I'm trying to look at this from a global point of view: will people in South Africa or the US looking for information on the government of the UK really by typing in "Her Majesty's Government" as their initial search? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 17:12, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- Its not the general use of the term though, in the past perhaps but all the other commonwealth realms now use the term Government of foo, just have a look at the incoming links to the HMG page [1] nearly every single one is relating to the UK gov making it the primary topic the page should be redirected with a hat note linking to the term. --Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 16:09, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- I think we're talking about the redirect at Her Majesty's Government; whether it should point to Government of the United Kingdom or to Her Majesty's Government (term). That said, I wonder about Barryrob's claim that "Her Majesty's Government" is used so frequently in the United Kingdom that it justifies that country's "ownership" of the term on Wikipedia, or even whether it's important to us or not where the term is most used. Putting the former aside for now, I'll ask again what wasn't answered before: is it really best for users that we direct them first to a selected specific use and then to the general application, or first to the general use and then to whatever specific they're looking for? --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 13:47, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- I oppose the proposed redirect, this should remain an article describing the term whilst linking at the top of the page to government of the UK. There is no reason to change this setup. BritishWatcher (talk) 09:58, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
- It would be giving WP:UNDUEWEIGHT to the usage of the term in other countries where it very rarely used, as opposed to the UK where it is frequently used--Barryob (Contribs) (Talk) 06:39, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
Right title?
editI'm not sure if this article should be called "Her Majesty's Government". The terms "His" and "Her" have been used throughout history, referring to the reigning monarch at the time. What will the article be called when Charles becomes King? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.36.83.101 (talk) 22:12, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
- The page can be moved when the time comes. --Ħ MIESIANIACAL 22:32, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
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Suggest delete, as this promotes improper usage, and the formal, "the British government" is preferred
edit- Referring to the Her Majesty's Government redirect (to "British government") article, not the article Her Majesty's Government (term),
"Her Majesty's Government" is informal language outside of the UK. Inside the UK its considered formal and proper no doubt, but its improper for non-British citizens to use this language, or to refer in a genuflecting way to the British or other monarch. Suggest delete, as this promotes improper usage, and the formal, "the British government" is preferred. Its the case that some good faith editors may agree to curtail this usage but are British subjects and not free to contradict state opinion, if so please recuse. -Inowen (talk) 05:37, 3 February 2018 (UTC)
Move discussion in progress
editThere is a move discussion in progress on Talk:His Holiness which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 01:15, 29 December 2018 (UTC)
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