Talk:Holy See and the United Nations

Foreign policy of the Holy See

This topic is far too broad and vague: it includes the diplomatic activities of the Holy See within the many bodies and organs of the UN system; the activities of catholic organizations (not the Holy See) as observers of UN activities (such as Catholic NGOs with consultative status of ECOSOC) and the cooperation between those catholic organizations with UN humanitarian efforts in the ground; the activities of catholic countries promoting catholic values within the intergovernmental organs of the UN System; and the activities of individual catholics promoting catholic values within the organization. I suggest limiting its scope only to the first one: the foreign policy of the Holy See.

I renamed the article from Roman Catholic Church and the United Nations to activities of the Holy See within the United Nations system in order to make the article's title reflect what the real subject matter is about. ADM (talk) 10:56, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

I split the article, moving part of its content to Foreign policy of the Holy See: multilateral issues since the substantive part was not limmited only to the UN but included other fora.BonifaciusVIII (talk) 16:13, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Papacy

Using papacy in this context is innacurate. The papacy, as a historical, religious or social entity, is different from the Holy See as a subject of international law.BonifaciusVIII (talk) 18:05, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Understood, the word papacy should therefore be left out of the introduction. ADM (talk) 18:21, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Undefined UN membership from 1944 to 1964

I find this title rather confusing, If anything, the Holy See was a Non-member, Non-observer during that period. I suggest either going back to the previous title or going for "Non participation between 1944 to 1964" eventhough it is not fully accurate. BonifaciusVIII (talk) 20:18, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

I tried to include the League of Nations part of history, where there was also no participation, which is why the correct title is somewhat difficult ot ascertain. I do agree with your suggestion though and will abide by it. ADM (talk) 20:21, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

I see what you mean. Probably a separate section or even a short page on the relationship between the HS and the League would be interesting. The books of Robert Araujo and Graham, that I quoted in the legal status article, have a wealth of info about it. Right now, though, I´m trying to finish Multilateral foreign policy of the Holy See I guess it will take me at least a couple of weeks just to fill in the blanks ... BonifaciusVIII (talk) 20:31, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

See Change campaign

Why is a single pressure groups mentioned for its campaign against the Holy See's UN status? At the moment it seems like an advert for a relatively insignificant group, inserted into a more important article. Without any references to show that it is significant (i.e. that the campaign had any diplomatic effect, or garnered serious consideration from diplomats and not merely the media), I suggest deletion. Thoughts? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.190.253.144 (talk) 23:42, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Holy See and the United Nations

I propose for the article to be moved to Holy See and the United Nations. My reasons are:

• the current title is needlessly long and cumbersome
• the current title would exclude any information on Holy See - United Nations relations when they were not part of the UN System, and this is covered in the article
• the new title would be in continuity with other titles in the series of articles: (China and the United Nations, India and the United Nations, Brazil and the United Nations, etc.)

I could have just moved the article, but maybe I'm missing something - this has been the title for the article since its creation in 2009. --$\color {Blue}{\mathcal {M}}$$\color {Blue}{\vec {(e\ ,}}$$\color {Blue}t)$ = ? 13:20, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Agreed, this is a good idea. TDL (talk) 15:54, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

I also concur. Good idea. Outback the koala (talk) 17:08, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

This seemed uncontroversial so I went ahead with the move. TDL (talk) 16:46, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

So it is done. I went through the links to the old title, now only talk and user pages link to it. --$\color {Blue}{\mathcal {M}}$$\color {Blue}{\vec {(e\ ,}}$$\color {Blue}t)$ = ? 19:29, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

And just for the record, the original title was "Activities of the Holy See within the United Nations system", a full 60 characters in comparison to the 31 of the new title. --$\color {Blue}{\mathcal {M}}$$\color {Blue}{\vec {(e\ ,}}$$\color {Blue}t)$ = ? 19:37, 6 September 2012 (UTC)