Talk:ICC Cricket Hall of Fame

Sortable table

The inductees would be best presented in a sortable table. TRM, where are you in my hour of need? --Dweller (talk) 12:59, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Done, I think... but for some reason I can't sort any tables at the moment! Someone who knows more than me should have a look at the Indian and Pakistan players and sort them appropriately... does Imran Khan come under I or K, and should Kapil Dev be under K or D? A table lends itself to expansion to more columns, maybe the years that they played test cricket, their role (ie batsman/spin bowler etc) and maybe the basic # tests/wickets/runs/avgs, but maybe that would be too much. Hope it all works for others. The-Pope (talk) 16:19, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm not sure I see the point if it's just got the existing columns. Is it really useful to sort by country? Stephen Turner (Talk) 22:12, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

While I agree that information needs to be expanded to make better use of the sortable tables, even just being able to sort by national team is useful and reveals interesting patterns about the relative level of inclusion per team. On a further note, how does a man who played a mere four tests (although an admiitedly fine cricketer) make an ICC Hall of Fame? Is there any information on the inclusion guidelines available similar to the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum -- Mattinbgn\^talk 22:38, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

This page suggests that there were/are 58 in the FICA Hall of Fame as named in 2002. I wonder which 3 missed out and why? We really need to know the inclusion and exclusion (how many years after retirement) criteria to make a decent article (and expand the table with more informative columns.The-Pope (talk) 23:27, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

My suspicion is that (as per established ICC practice) the ICC are making it up as they go along and there is no set criteria to be considered for inclusion. Further, inclusion will be heavily influenced but national boards with political and financial pull. -- Mattinbgn\^talk 23:29, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Table will sort better and be more useful with some amends and some additional data. If names are formatted for sorting, and if dates and maybe number of Tests, and maybe Test averages? Seee some FLs for high quality tables - off the top of my head, try Wisden Cricketers of the Year for images and List of Norwich City F.C. Players of the Year for tabulation, esp use of {{sortname|Darren|Huckerby}}. --Dweller (talk) 11:09, 7 January 2009 (UTC) More data: primary role, i.e. batsman, bowler, wicket-keeper, all-rounder. --Dweller (talk) 13:47, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Added role and left some question marks there about claims for all-rounder status that others may wish to comment on. -- Mattinbgn\^talk 14:02, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Images

Would images be a useful addition? If so, what is the best method to include them?-- Mattinbgn\^talk 22:40, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

See my comment above. Also, I'd suggest getting at least one from each country represented in the list and a good spread of decades. --Dweller (talk) 13:46, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Dazed and Confused

What a mess. I've worked out that there were 50 original FICA hall of famers. A page on the old cricnet site (I think it is now www.thepca.co.uk) and cricinfo give some info on how the 50 were chosen in 1999. Then in 2000, 5 more were added - Ian Chappell, Gooch, Rhodes, Roberts and Wooley. But then this more recent story has the number at 58 and the last one being held in 2002. This story says that three players will be added to the existing 55 at the 2002 dinner, suggesting that there wasn't a 2001 dinner.

This opinion piece attacks the decision to induct Mike Atherton (I'm not joking!) but doesn't mention who else was inducted, only by the country numbers given vs the known 55, it was a South African and a West Indian - Courtney Walsh was mentioned in that Lynn McConnell article and isn't in the 55, so he could be #57. Cricinfo doesn't seem to have any other information (only the other award winners and this one that has the magic words "not sanctioned by the ICC or ACB"!), the wayback machine on cricnet.com doesn't have anything, a search on Atherton "Hall of Fame" finds nothing else of note. Can anyone find any information on who the other two players inducted on or about the 10th of July 2002 are (and why they appear to have been disowned by the Hall of Fame now!) This article seems to be from the same awards night... but again no mention of the Hall of Fame. The-Pope (talk) 12:39, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Honorifics

Do we need the titles etc of the players included with their name (Sir Len Hutton, Sir Ian Botham, Sir Richard Hadlee, Lord Colin Cowdrey etc.) It seems like overkill to me, not to mention (mildly) discriminatory against those nations without imperial honours systems (i.e. everywhere except for the UK, NZ and the WI). No doubt Gavaskar has been given high Indian honours equivalent to this rank but that is not included (If he hasn't he should have) -- Mattinbgn\^talk 14:07, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Remove them. --Dweller (talk) 14:41, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

Role

My only concern with this list is that the playing role is unreferenced. Because it is unreferenced, it is effectively OR, and in many ways subjective. While Wilfred Rhodes can be viewed as a bowler, he can also be viewed as an all-rounder. While in some cases this is provided by Cricinfo (as in the case of Ian Botham) where it isn't it could cause arguments and edit wars. Other than that the list looks okay on first glance, I fixed a couple of references that I noticed were off, and will check the others later when I have a more detailed look at the article. Lead seems a little short too, but I don't know how it can be lengthened really. Harrias ^talk 14:35, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick response Harrias. I had noticed during the "tarting up" phase of the list that several "alternative" roles had been commented out. I wonder if there's any use at all in this column or whether I should just remove it? The Rambling Man (talk) 14:45, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

It would be interesting, but I think that for so many of the great players their role wasn't always clear, especially delving into the past. Probably best to remove it unless there is a decent place to reference them. Harrias ^talk 14:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I'll have a look at that later on. Thanks for your help! The Rambling Man (talk) 15:09, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

I looked at the list as well, after a talk page request, and found nothing really negative to say. I did notice that a couple of the lead's paragraphs look small, as noted above, but I'm also unsure of what could be added; after all, it's basically a start-up at this point. If there's any more information on the selection process, maybe that would be worth including. Anyway, good work here. Giants2008 (27 and counting) 23:22, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

W. G. Grace

The introduction section talks about W. G. Grace retiring from cricket in 1899, while Grace's own page lists him playing until 1908 with his final test in 1899. The table looks right (its list final test) but he was still playing first-class cricket for a few years after that.

Thanks. I've added "Test" to the lead so it reads that retired from "Test cricket" in 1899. The Rambling Man (talk) 15:45, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

2011 additions

Can someone who knows how to edit these sortable tables please add Curtly Ambrose, Belinda Clark, Alan Davidson (cricketer) and Fred Spofforth please. See here for a source. Many thanks. -- Mattinbgn (talk) 08:04, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Done, but we'll need to add and ref their stats from Cricinfo... The Rambling Man (talk) 08:24, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Thank you. -- Mattinbgn (talk) 10:47, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

No worries. I added the refs as well, so we're up to date I think! The Rambling Man (talk) 10:50, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Ordering of table

The order of the table rows appears to be alphabetical, with the exception of the first three. Perhaps someone with more skill with tables than I have could move them to the correct position? (Personally I'd prefer it if entries were chronological by date of induction, but that would mean a lot. of work.) JH (talk page) 09:59, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

Have done that. Cheers. The Rambling Man (talk) 11:26, 1 January 2013 (UTC)

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