Talk:International Commission of Inquiry Into the 1932–1933 Famine in Ukraine

Real report

See real report and info about commissiom at Ru:WP instead of deception currently mentioned. Jo0doe (talk) 09:27, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Holodomor Template

Holodomor Template was added to this article strictly for background information of related articles in Wikipedia. The Holodomor template is patterned after the Holocaust Template and the Armenian Genocide Template.

The template, if any, should meet the consensus by its content. So far it is a random and strange collection of stuff someone might have "heard" or something. It cannot be used in articles. --Irpen 05:47, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

When were you appointed sole arbiter of whether something can or cannot be used in an article? The template serves a useful navigational purpose. Please seek consensus first. Martintg (talk) 06:18, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

The other way around, Martin. Seek consensus for inclusion, both of the stuff like RSFSR Code or Pravda to the Ukrainian Famine template, and for the controversial template into the articles. --Irpen 06:20, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

You claim in your edit summary that "this was discussed a lobg time ago", what previous dicussion are you alluding to? I see nothing on Template_talk:Holodomor that indicates there is any controversial issue here. Martintg (talk) 06:31, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Here is one place. --Irpen 06:44, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

This discussion is copied to Template talk:Holodomor. --Irpen 16:39, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

This is an English Language Wikipedia

This is an English Language Wikipedia so please use ENGLISH references were available. Final report is available in English - the ability to be fluent in Russian is not a requirement to be an editor here. You may not be aware that there is a RUSSIAN version of Wikipedia developed by Russian speaking editors that has many articles about the Holodomor. Please respect the editors that are not fluent in Russian. Bobanni (talk) 14:21, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

• Does you have it and read it? I've Russian which equal to English - if you provide ref to english - non problem - otherwice it's vandalism213.159.247.177 (talk) 16:06, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Original Research DELETED

Information provided from another source other than International Commission of Inquiry. The assumption that the inquiry report is wrong is original research. The Soviet sources probably do not meet Wikipedia's requirements for reliable source. The Soviet sources do not have the reputation for fact checking and have the reputation of publishing inaccurate information Bobanni (talk) 01:33, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Information related to International Commission of Inquiry. There no other sources for USSR instead Soviet. All of them recognized and used many times by many historians. Thus Vandalism will be revertedJo0doe (talk) 07:03, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

You have two sources that give different data about the same thing. How can you say that one is right and the other is wrong. All you can report is that the sources disagree. The Soviet sources do not have the reputation for accuracy or fact checking.Bobanni (talk) 07:11, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

There no different data on Census, Export etc - simply one is widelly accepted while rest known as Big Lie approachJo0doe (talk) 13:21, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

International Commission of Inquiry report

Dear editors, I would be grateful if you provide an explanation for your continues deletion of Significant important for visitors information. In other hand – I can’t find in Report confirmation about “The Commission was partially funded by donations from the Ukrainian diaspora” – mean word “partially” – until you’ve able to prove “partially” please preserve original wording. Thank you Jo0doe (talk) 07:05, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Vandalism

Some of editors repeatedly remove sentences which does not reflect fringe theory - namelly

(while assumed Ukrainians as sole nation and inhabitants of the Ukrainian SSR

Report of the Commission p.3

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Commission majority does not believe that the 1932-33 famine was systematically organized to crush the Ukrainian nation once and for all.

- Report of the Commission p.5 http://www.ukrainianworldcongress.org/Holodomor/Holodomor-Commission.pdf Jo0doe (talk) 06:29, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

This particular statement does not exist on page 3. Bandurist (talk) 11:01, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

This prartucular statement is a summary from compartion table of 1939 census at p2 and conclussion appeared on page 3.Jo0doe (talk) 19:38, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

That information is not found on page 3. Bandurist (talk) 01:23, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Bottom of p2 and top of p3. Any difficluties with p5?Jo0doe (talk) 07:53, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Its not there 10:22, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Interesting article on Soviet-Fascist co-operation here title Bandurist (talk) 10:58, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Conclusions - vandalised?

The text looks strange.Xx236 (talk) 11:52, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

For Joddoe

for your information, none of the members of the commission were ever suspected of Russo phobia, and their report could hardly be suspected of that! This is your own conclusion( no other sources)

The same for all other opinions you wrote in this article : controversy facts are your self interpretation and not justified.

Please read carefully article text first. I simply mentioned what actually exist at report:

• If in it there were numerous claims like “predominantly Russian” doings something nasty– it’s called Russo phobia – it’s clear and there nothing something new.

this is false : hating Russian is Russo phobia, saying that someone is Russian, which is true, is not Russo phobia. Saying that someone is Ukrainian is not Ukraino phobia, saying that someone is from ukrainian diaspora is not being ukraino phobian, and so on...

• If there a notable discrepancy in figures and statements presented in the article – it’s also summarized and given with examples of such – there nothing about OR – simply facts and summary of text.

This is your own opinion! you should find an independant analyse published by some reasearcher not joddosearcher.....

What’s actually wrong with

• In fact these studies are often the work of specialists of Ukrainian (Diaspora) origin or were funded by sponsors in the Ukrainian diaspora

This is said once, not useful to repeat in every sentences...

Thank you.Jo0doe (talk) 10:03, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

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