Talk:Ishi

Walked into the white man's world?

This should probably be changed because California in 1911 was extremely multi-cultural. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.8.46.96 (talk) 05:53, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

Old comments

article says" "Museum of Anthropology at UCSF where " Shouldn't that be UC Berkeley ? GangofOne 20:31, 1 November 2005 (UTC)

Nah... He died at the Museum of Anthropology in San Francisco. They even have a room devoted to the Yahi.

That's right Kroeber brought Ishi to the Anthropology Dept which at the time was in what is now the Parnassus Campus of UCSF. The Anthropology Dept was later moved to Berkeley. Dgrjazz (talk) 14:34, 4 June 2009 (UTC) dgr (David G Rhoades)

Mysterious people

Ishi's no longer mysterious? We don't even know his real name.

Mrs Kroeber's book says that "Ishi" is just the Yahi word for (generic) "man." interstingly, the Hebrew word for Man is... Ish. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 45.49.25.109 (talk) 21:58, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

caption

Is Ishi on the right or left in the picture? The caption should be fixed. -- Mikeblas 00:41, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

there were many massacres... and other aspects of this article seem incorrect.

Tournament

It says in the article that the American Ishi Degree is awarded to anyone who can match Ishi's '1934 archery score. Ishi Died in 1916 and it can't be to hard to beat an 18-year deceased person at archery

I think that 1934 means his score, no?--Cúchullain ^t/c 04:06, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Brain

In an article about Albert Einstein's brain it mention Ishi's brain was removed and studied, I don't think it mentions it here does it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.100.226.191 (talk) 00:54, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

The last

The article says, Ishi is believed to have been the last Native American in Northern California to have lived most of his life completely outside the European American culture.

That seems like an unusually circumspect description. Wasn't Ishi the last free American Indian in the continental U.S.? Why can't we say something more directly about that?—Greg Pandatshang (talk) 00:02, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Well, we'd need a reliable source that says that. It's probably the sources that are the source of the circumspection, which in turn might be based on their unwillingness to commit to a statement that might then be refuted by an obscure counterexample they hadn't heard of. Herostratus (talk) 07:23, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

==

There may have been a few more "free Indians," so some measure of caution is in order. Certainly in the West, death was rapid. See story of Captain Jack, for instance. KSRolph (talk) 02:37, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Ishi's Name

Ishi's name was Yehasha. The reason he couldn't tell anybody this is because it was the custom of his tribe to introduce other members, you couldn't introduce yourself. Since he was the last of his group, there was no one to introduce him. Also, he wasn't the last "wild" Indian. Ishi had plenty of contact with white people. And there were other Indians living in the wild too; they didn't get the attention Ishi did because Ishi became a study for an anthro professor. The Indian tribes were inter-marrying, so Ishi was probably of mixed blood--and there were other Indians left with Yahi blood in them. He was not the "last" ethnic member of his tribe, that's just a popular myth. There was inter-breeding. Theodora Kroeber was a hack and her writings are full of inaccuracies and outright lies. I grew up in Ishi country, the locals know a lot, but they aren't writers or professors so their knowledge doesn't get published. 69.106.223.169 (talk) 01:29, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

So how do you know his name was Yehasha, if he couldn't tell anyone? As to the other, you have a point, but what are we supposed to do? The situation you point out is a problem in scholarly research generally -- the unvoiced are unheard. It's not up to us to fix this though, it's up to a university or newspaper or book publisher to send someone down there and dig up the facts. Then we can publish it here. Herostratus (talk) 02:35, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

The locals in Tehama County published a local history magazine called "Tales of Tehama"--that's where I read his name was Yehasha (a white person overheard him being called that). And Ishi did not walk out of the wilderness starving--he was an Indian and could live off the land; Tehama County has salmon, trout, deer, bear, acorns, etc. It was the land of plenty for the Indians. Apparently he was running away from somebody when they found him. There's an interesting article in this week's Chico Enterprise Record newspaper about Ishi and some of the pop culture myths about him. There's a number of local historians and anthropologists that are trying to de-construct the made-up nonsense that Theodora Kroeber wrote about Ishi. If you talk to local Indians, their take on Ishi is different than the white man's fairy tales. I'm just trying to give a head's up, so people will be aware the real story is still being put together. 69.106.223.169 (talk) 10:57, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

This is fine and we would welcome this. Here's something from the Chico Enterprise Record, maybe that's the story you mentioned, but it doesn't tell much. Tales of Tehama sounds interesting and possibly useful. Whether we can use it as a source I don't know. But if it's true that the story is wrong, your #1 best path for getting this out -- both here at Wikipedia and in the world generally, I guess -- is to find some professor, or reporter, or writer, or someone like that to take an interest in this. Then we can cite that person. Herostratus (talk) 16:20, 29 September 2011 (UTC)

Local history magazines should be fine as source when the context is relevant, as providing alternative views - not for reshaping the entire article though. If that issue of the Tales of Tehama can be found att libraries and if someone digs it out, it sounds like it could make for an interesting paragraph in the article. --Siden (talk) 11:54, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

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Ishi's love of matches glue

I remember learning about Ishi during elementary school and how, while little of White Man's world impressed him, he did at least grow fond of matches and glue. link Maybe someone could add something about this to the article? -- 71.141.100.130 (talk) 03:45, 21 June 2012 (UTC)

Birth date... da hell?

For some reason the article gives his birthday as "September 9, 1861". Two things about that:

• How the hell would then know the exact date of his birth.
• The ref given for the birth date doesn't mention it in any way shape or form.

I suspect trollery; let's be vigilant people. I've changed it to "circa 1860" which I think is an earlier version, subject to some evidence that we have an actual RS for the birth date. Herostratus (talk) 16:51, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Comparison to Ota Benga, Similar case

The article does not mention he was every displayed at a zoo as this last part claims. The source says he worked at a museum where he would craft indigenous artifacts to give away to people at the museum or visitors. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lunaticcloud (talk • contribs) 00:10, 21 February 2016 (UTC)

American

Why is a first nations persons nationality listed as American, He is Yasi only and forever — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.65.23.104 (talk) 03:37, 26 March 2016 (UTC)

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Oak Avenue and Quincy Road, where Ishi, was found in 1911

"At the corner of Oak Avenue and Quincy Road, east of the project area, is the site where the Native American, Ishi, was found in 1911. The site is the location of the Ward Slaughterhouse where Ishi was discovered in the corral, emaciated, starving, exhausted and frightened. Ishi was reportedly the “last known wild Indian in North America” (Hoover, Mildred, Hero E. Rensch and Ethel G. Rensch 1970 Historic Spots in California (third edition). William Abeloe, editor. Stanford University Press, Palo Alto.). He was taken to the Oroville jail, and was held there until A. L. Kroeber and T. T. Waterman, anthropologists from University of California, Berkeley, arrived and arranged to take him to San Francisco. Ishi shared his valuable knowledge of the culture, language and history of the Yahi tribe with the anthropologists, and he also worked at the museum. He died of tuberculosis in 1916 (The Santa Barbara Indian Center and Dwight Dutschke 1982 “A History of American Indians in California.” In: Five Views: An Ethnic Sites Survey for California, Department of Parks and Recreation, 1988.:39)."
— Peak & Associates, Inc. (22 May 2012). Butte County Hospital site-specific review and evaluation (PDF). Retrieved 11 February 2021.

.... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 07:22, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

James J. Callahan, Jr.

"Described as a novel based on historical data. Some of this is history and some is a story"

• “The Killing of Ishi” Blog by James J. Callahan, Jr.
• The Killing of Ishi by James J. Callahan, Jr.

Independently published Book (February 12, 2019)

.... 0mtwb9gd5wx (talk) 07:44, 13 February 2021 (UTC)

Chiricahua Apache in the Sierra Madres

Im a mixed race kid from Tucson, Az. My understanding from multiple books, "'They Never Surrendered' by Douglass Meed" and "'The Apache Diaries' by Goodwin & Goodwin', as well as my family history, is that the last wild Apaches were forced out of the Sierra Madres in 1935. That is when my Great grandfather met a Senorita and gave birth to my Grandmother in Tucson. That's what I know. 2600:1011:A03D:721C:6564:8460:BB12:A4C9 (talk) 03:26, 7 September 2024 (UTC)