Talk:John II, Count of Holland

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Moved from Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Proposals: The data of John II, Count of Hainaut is probably not correct. He succeeded Margaret II, Countess of Flanders and not John I, Count of Hainaut. John II was actually John I, so the name of the article should be changed.--Daanschr 12:33, 26 December 2005 (UTC)

Requested Move

The current location of the page is very poor: it has a long, complicated and unguessable disambiguation. I suggest it be moved to John II, Count of Holland, which is accurate in numbering. Choess 05:07, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

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Support; anything's better than this - but see discussion. Septentrionalis 13:05, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

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if John I of Avesnes is correct, the subject of this article was John II of Hainault too. Which realm is more notable in the 14th century? I don't know. Septentrionalis 13:08, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Don't know. I proposed "John II of Holland" in part to sidestep the question of numbering in Hainaut, but as his successors are all named as "X of Hainaut," we may have to settle that issue here. FWIW, Britannica calls the elder John "John of Avesnes, Count of Hainaut" and this John "John I [of Hainaut]", but numbers him "John II", for his county of Holland. Choess 19:28, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

The article has now been moved. Mangojuice^talk 16:36, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

John II's nephew?

Something is amiss. In the article on John II, Count of Holland it says Floris V, Count of Holland is the nephew of John II. In the article on Adelaide of Holland it says Floris V is her nephew. Adelaide is the mother of John II. Explain please.--Christie the puppy lover (talk) 12:56, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Floris V is the son of William II of Holland, who was Adelaide's brother. Thus he is definately her nephew. Since John II is Adelaide's son, that would make Floris V the son of his mother's brother, and thus his first cousin, at least in THAT family. It is entirely possible that Floris could also have been John II's nephew on the other side of the family. John I of Avesnes, John II's father, had only one brother that I can find, one Baldwin; that would mean that Floris would have had to have been Baldwin's son in order to be considered John II's nephew on that side of the family. However, we know this not to be so. It looks as though the article may be in error unless someone else can come up with a better explanation. --Jayron32 14:38, 4 November 2009 (UTC)