Talk:Kate Shelley

Date of birth

I've seen Kate's age in 1881 given as 15, 16, 17, and 18 in the various cited references. But the most knowledgable-sounding references give it as 17, and this is what the article originally used until an anonymous user changed it in July, pulling the birth date of "September 29, 1865" apparently out of thin air. The Irish Midlands Ancestory reference specifically addresses the age discrepancies and explains where the commonly-cited age of 15 comes from, and that 17 was the correct age. So I'm going to change the date of birth back to December 1863 (exact day unknown). --GregU 07:43, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

The article is, admittedly, terribly unsourced.

Irish Midlands Ancestory says her parents were married in February 1863 and she was baptised on December 12, 1863. James, Mayme, Margaret and John were later born to the family. But the typewriter hadn't been invented yet, and there's not a lot of difference between a 3 and a 5 in many people's handwriting.

The 1880 census shows a Kate Shelley living in Worth (Boone County) Iowa

The record shows

Margaret Shelley 35 born in Ireland

Kate Shelley 15

Mary A. Shelley 8

Margaret Shelley 6

John Shelley 4

It doesn't mention father's name or age, but shows he was born in Ireland.

According to the Irish Midlands Ancestry website, Mike Shelley was her father's name. He worked as foreman on a section crew for the C&NW, until he died in 1878, so I'm pretty sure this is the right record.

Apparently Mayme is Mary A., but what happened to James? Did he die? Did he move out of the house to make it on his own and lighten the load on his widowed mother? In any case, the gap from Kate to Mary is too big; it's not common that a family stops having kids for 7 years, then has 3 more stairstep kids. Maybe it was James, Mayme, Mary, Margaret and John, and both James and Mayme died.

The census was dated April 1 back then, too, and they didn't write down numbers, they marked circles, so handwriting is not an issue. If she was born early in 1865, she could have been 17 in July 1881. If she had been born in December 1863, she would have been 18 in 1881, which is older than the Irish Midlands Ancestry says.

Consequently, I'm assuming that she was baptised in December 1865, and born early in 1865. ClairSamoht - Help make Wikipedia the most authoritative source of information in the world 11:38, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Great work. The Irish Midlands site lists James, and the IAGenWeb site instead lists "Michael Jr." and says he drowned around 1878. So the "gap" son's name must have been Michael James, and he probably went by his middle name to avoid confusion with his father. And I think Mayme was Mary A.

However I'm not convinced on the birth year, as your math above doesn't add up. If she was born early in 1865, she would have been 16 in July 1881. And if she had been born in December 1863, she would have been 17 in 1881, which agrees with the Irish Midlands and IAGenWeb sources. I believe the December 1863 date still sounds the most legitimate, even though that doesn't agree with her being 15 on April 1, 1880. To resolve this, maybe we need to find what sources the IAGenWeb and the Irish Midlands Ancestory sites used, if that's possible. --GregU 09:30, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

First Bridge Named for a Woman?

The unsourced statement that this was the first bridge in the United States named for a woman conflicts with the article for the Betsy Ross Bridge article with a sourced statement saying that it was the first named for a woman. Thoughts on this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by RFlynn26 (talk • contribs) 02:46, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

Points to incorporate

ate Shelley - additional information - source Railroad Avenue by Hubbard pp.136-146 except for new information on the Kate Shelley bridge

1. C&NW railroad gave her a gold medal and a lifetime pass over the system. 2. C&NW in 1901 named the then new bridge over the Des Moines River the Kate Shelley bridge. The bridge was replaced (although the original was left standing) by the Union Pacific between 2006 and 2009 and is designated either "New Kate Shelley Bridge" or "Kate Shelley High Bridge" depending on which reference you happen to check. 3. Monument to her in Dubuque,l Iowa. 4. Boone local of the Brotherhood of Railroad Trainmen organized in 1886 and chose the name Kate Shelley Lodge Number 204. At the time of the Hubbard book it was (and perhaps may still be) the only brotherhood lodge named for a woman. 5. Bronze plaque at the Methodist Church in Ogden commemorating her deeds. 6. Ballads/Poems include those written by Eugene J. Hall (Kate Shelley), W.C. Hafley (Brave Kate Shelley), and MacKinlay Cantor (The Ballad of Kate Shelley). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.37.173.247 (talk) 20:02, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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Removal of age references

I removed the age references as Kate was stated as being 15 in 1880. Her birth year is stated as 1863 which seems to have consensus. Doing the math she would have been 17 on her birthday in 1880. I realize that there has been many conflicting accounts of her birth date and age at the time of the incident in 1881. At the time of the incident in July 1881 she would have been 17 (turning 18 in December of that year) if her 1863 birth date is correct. There is new information sourced from the research of Misty McNally with highlights here: https://iowaculture.gov/history/blog/remembering-real-kate-shelley.

While I am reluctant to wade any deeper into this issue, if there is an editor that wishes to do further searching for sources that can verify the ages that I removed please do so.THX1136 (talk) 01:20, 19 February 2018 (UTC)

Other trains named after women

There are other trains, besides the CNW's Kate Shelley. Norfolk and Western had its Pocahontas (train), and the Pennsylvania Railroad had its Nellie Bly that went from New York City to Atlantic City.Dogru144 (talk) 19:34, 16 July 2022 (UTC)