Talk:Khairallah Talfah

Wonder

i just wonder about more info about his brother and his uncle

anti-Persianism?

As the books seems to insult Persians as much as Jews, can we have a quote on Persians too. Not that I enjoy insults on Persians but in order to counter the myth that all muslims are conspiring to get rid of Israel and Jews, we might want to be fair and mention the unsubstantiated hatred between different ethnic groups of islamic faith. -- 09:20, 30 December 2006 74.140.47.229

He sympathized with the Nazis

The source for this is a book in which it is difficult to find any Arab who isn't "Nazi-sympathising". And that single adjective, with no example, explanation or source, is all the book provides as evidence. The fact that it appears immediately following a fake quotation from Sami al-Jundi, which does not appear in the given source, should clich the decision. Zero^talk 09:03, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

The info does not appear to be controversial. Could you support your view with a reliable source? Infinity Knight (talk) 09:22, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

The onus is not on deletion, it is on insertion. Where is your reliable source? Zero^talk 09:24, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

Here is an illustration of the reliability of this source. The Nazi turd Dieter Wisliceny claimed that al-Husseini had visited Auschwitz, but no evidence has ever surfaced. The "proof" this book presents is that Himmler once met al-Husseini in "the Ukrainian town of Zhitomir, near Auschwitz" (p164). Did they think we wouldn't look at a map? Zhitomir is 673km from Auschwitz in a straight line and 794km by road. Did the authors lie on purpose or out of ignorance? I don't care, but I know they can't be trusted for anything which doesn't have a checkable source. Zero^talk 09:52, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

@Zero0000: I looked at the book you mentioned ("Nazis, Islamists, and the Making of the Modern Middle East") and agree it describes almost every Arab mentioned as "Nazi sympathizer", which is strange. I agree with your comments, especially "single adjective, with no example, explanation or source, is all the book provides as evidence".

Specific to Khairallah Talfah, this is all it has to say about him and nazism: "The [Ba’th] movement soon spread to Iraq, where one of its early adherents was a Nazi-sympathizing officer named Khairallah Talfah.", followed by mentioning he was imprisoned and that his nephew was Saddam Hussein. There is no other mention to Talfah in the book. It was a passing mention with no citation nor other detail or analysis regarding this sympathizing, so it does not meet WP:RS. This was added back by Infinity along with a further equally non-WP:RS source "Iraq: From Sumer to Saddam" where it also fails WP:RS with only passingly mentions: "In any event, his uncle Khairallah, a fervent Arab nationalist (and also a Nazi sympathiser), enrolled Saddam in the local primary school." Then there's nothing more than that with regards to anything to do with the Nazis. I'd equate including such sources as publishing, "Quarterback Joe Montana, who was also a meth user, ..." and using that as a source, which is amateurish. Maybe WP:REDFLAG applies too since the Nazi label is somewhat exceptional. Saucysalsa30 (talk) 06:35, 21 October 2020 (UTC)

Mostly unsourced, unverifiable content and lack of notability

A related article in less satisfactory shape and edit warring by SPAs piqued my interest in the state of this particular article in recent weeks. This article's content is mostly unsourced/unverifiable, and half of it is not about the article subject at that. After further review and research, sourcing regarding Talfah is in line with what already exists in the article: strictly brief mentions in a handful of sources otherwise focused on 1) his nephew Saddam Hussein, or 2) a general history on Iraq. In terms of verifiable and matter-of-fact information, this article could be trimmed down to him being the uncle of the former Iraqi dictator, his participation in the 1941 anti British coup (there's no detail on any significance of his role in that, however), being a mayor of Baghdad and couple nominal titles, and being a member of the short-lived Iraqi Independence Party. On his own, Talfah does not appear to be notable, and would probably have been lost to history if not for his familial relationship to Hussein and the substantial post-Gulf War interest in the leader's family and relatives. Despite this, still few details exist on his life and career and is without non-trivial coverage.

The most, if not only, notable thing about Talfah is his participation in the 1941 coup, but there's no mention other than that he participated with the rest of the Iraqi army involved, which in and of itself is not notable (if he was Rashid Ali, that would be different). If this article hasn't been salvageable since 2005, it doesn't appear it can be, given anything noteworthy regarding him is already in this Wikipedia article. For the time being, adding the notability template would be fitting. Saucysalsa30 (talk) 02:38, 6 January 2021 (UTC)