Talk:Koolie

Koolie Page Redirect undone

 I do hope I have done this correctly. 

There should now be two individual pages, one the original Koolie page on the Koolie/Coolie breed of Australia and the second untouched page on the American - German Coolie. My reason for this action is that I have tried to reach everyone that could be reached about the impropriety of the Koolie page redirect, resulting in, no resolve to the issues, so I have taken matters into my own hands. Sorry it has taken so long, but as I have written else where, all over the place, I do not sleep here. I have been involved with the ongoing research into the Koolie/Coolie origins and the efforts of the DNA collection around Australia, so have been understanably distracted. But as you can see I am here now and obviously will set this page in my watch list, hopefuly to afford the public the right to make it's own choice. Happy New Year Tjukurpa (talk) 12:43, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Same standards as ANKC? Untrue

Since conformation is the main thrust of ANKC as it is with most all-breed clubs (all, except the UKC AFIAK) I think the note to the breed table is misleading. This is much better explained in the body of the article, I think. Dogs in other breeds would also have this interesting status, in fact, as I'm typing I'm thinking there's an article or article addendum here--what about obvious purebreds if imported to a country where they're not recognized, for example? Quill 21:46, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Oh, yeah, just what we need, more ideas for articles to write! ;-) There's some related discussion here: Border_collies#Breed_standards and I think I put in similar stuff in some other herding breed articles. I don't know what we'd call such an article... hmmm, I'm almost sure that some article discusses related topics with several breeds referenced, dang, you'd think I'd know, because I'm pretty sure I wrote such a thing. Beats me where. Elf | Talk 23:26, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Anecdotal stuff

This is largely unproven/undocumented so I'm removing for now. It can always be added back in later--or pieces thereof:

German settlers used similar looking herding dogs called "Tigers" pronounced with a short "i" which were mistaken for Collies, the German guttural pronunciation of Collie sounds like Koolie, it is generally believed that the Tiger is a foundation breed for the Koolie along with smooth coated Collies, Tigers have been recorded to arriving in Australia as early as 1825. It is hoped that through the collection of the Koolie DNA by the Koolie Club of Australia for Genetic Technologies Services Australia, that the Koolie marker will be discovered and other breed influence can be identified.

I remember specifically asking some German speakers when I was writing my first article on Koolies, the feeling was that Collie was perfectly pronounceable so this explanation would be unlikely. The Tiger as a foundation for the Koolie is a theory, not a general belief. Records from 1825? I would like to see some before we state that as fact.

As far as I know GTS can trace lineage, not specific breeds.

Quill 21:55, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Germans pronouncing the word Collie like coolie is a bit silly? I have never heard anyone in Germany pronounce it that way (albeit growing up there). I heard the German immigrants brought the tiger with them? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 1.124.42.169 (talk) 11:36, 27 February 2014 (UTC)

Allow me to introduce myself I am a founding committee member, Editor, researcher and Publicist of the Koolie Club of Australia. I am not familiar with how one gets assistance or clarifies ones source, so please forgive me if this approach is unacceptable. I need to raise a couple of issues and hope someone may help me to sort through them. Firstly my information regarding the mispronunciation of the word Collie by a heavily accent German of over 100 years ago is quite sound, one of our researchers is German and feels that this is not only possible but probable. He has an enormous book called the German settler in Australia the first 100 years. In this book it states that the Lutheran Germans who first settled in SA spoke a language that was divorced from the original German spoken in Germany at that time, being around the early 1800s, his Grandmother who does not know a word of English pronounces Collie as Koolie. If we consider that many of the early German settlers were of a rural background their speech would differ as it does here in Australia. Does this explanation warrant the replacement of the piece that was removed. Later this year I shall be joining several Tiger breeders in German to collect their DNA as you know DNA can discover linage and this is what we are attempting to do, currently with our own registered Koolies, and soon with German Tigers and Collies from the highlands of Scotland. I am not an authority but do have a passion for seeing the job done thoroughly and I learn quickly. Quill could you please tell me what was the name of the Article you wrote on Koolies you refer to, I am always looking for reference material. Second issue I removed an addition to the Koolie stub covering standards because I wanted it discussed first as to it appropriates at this time, it is not our wish to dictate to anyone regarding standards or the need for one we only wish to continue a slow, cautious approach we have found success with, there is still much to learn regarding the Koolie as a working breed and companion, it's health, skeletal structure, and genetic make up to rush into a hastily considered standard, produced by people who have little or no first hand knowledge of the breed itself please I can be reach at this address tjukurpa@pacific.net.au to continue this discussion. (Tjukurpa 06:17, 3 May 2006 (UTC))

If the german immigrants came from northern germany, then they may have spoken Low German. It's very different from high german and was very usual till the early 20th century. An example: house (english), Haus (high german), Hus (lower german). This people spoke ever platt; and it's possible that many of them don't understood high german nor english. There exists a joke, that immigrants from north and south germany had to speak english to understand each other. If you look for a german connection is here an possible ancestor of the Koolie: pages 125 and 126 It's very probable that farm people from the Brunswick area spoke platt. The story with C and K in the German alphabet seems to be nonsense - i've never heard something like this.

I've read somewhere, that is was forbidden to import german shepherds to australia, because the government feared that these "dangerous wolfdogs" (some lineages where called Elsässer Wolfshund for a time) could mix them with the dingo. In the 19th century where all dogs of the shepherds called Schäferhund (shepherd dog). The breed of the German shepherd was'nt (fully) separated from the Altdeutschen (today often called Hütehunde instead Schäferhunde). So immigrants could have labeled this dogs as Collies, spoken Cullie by northgermans (speculative). I hope my english is understandable. regards from germany--Zuviele Interessen (talk) 19:30, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

Where is the proof that these dogs existed in Australia since the 1800's? I am unable to find any link to where the information was obtained. Shouldn't that be removed, until it can be proven?

The Coolie is not related to the German Tiger. It is a British collie dog. The whole German Coolie debate is sterile - the dogs are plainly a collie breed and the name reflects this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.90.192.244 (talk) 03:59, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

Re:anecdotal stuff

Genetic Technology Services is currently working with the Koolie Club of Australia to find a DNA marker for the breed and is currently working on several other breeds.

The club is currently researching the history of the breed and the German Tiger as an ancestor is looking very likely, GTS will also look at DNA of the Tiger once samples can be arranged. German farmers settled in Australia in the early 1800's in large numbers, it is highly likely they brought their own working dogs with them, as did British settlers who brought the ancestors of the Kelpie and Australian Cattle Dog. Koolieoz 00:41, 6 March 2006 (UTC) == This page is being vandalised by someone with personal agenda's and not for the good of Wikipedia or the Koolie so I have reverted it to the last serious content (Koolieoz 17:30, 9 May 2006 (UTC))

Ann and Kerrie, why do you both continue to delete information from the American German Coolie research? You are NOT the only two doing research on the GERMAN COOLIE. I have proof that the foundation dogs from the Tjukurpa Kennels (Kerrie Challenger) were obtained from the pound and some were found as strays. The Australian's may NOT care if their offspring or foundation dogs are without merit (no lineage), but the Americans do. You and Kerrie may not care if there isn't a Breed Standard for your dogs, but the American Members and breeders of the German Coolies do! A breed standard was voted on and passed by the members of the German Coolie Club of America. The breed standard that was posted here and then deleted by Kerrie, was to guard against the breeding of substandard dogs, maybe you don't care about that, but the American's do. The breed standard faults pigeon toes, cow hocked, overshot jaws, undershot jaws, bad temperament, etc... if the Australians do not want to guard against that, that is fine, but the Americans DO!! This page is not being vandalized, it's being added to for the world to see and read other research that has been obtained and where the GERMAN COOLIE is going in the United States. I know that you will just delete this, but I will continue to post it. And yes Kerrie, I DO have first hand knowledge of German Coolies, rather you like it or not.

Quill, or someone from Wikipedia, please email me ( yatahae_koolies@yahoo.com ), I'd love to talk to you about the emails that I've received from Kerrie Challenger/Tjukurpa Kennels and the research that we have done.

Yatahae, your vandalism was reverted because this is not the place to play petty games, please read the policies and guidelines. One person with 18 months experience with a breed and a club with 2 members does not make an authority with the right to dictate a standard to people with up to 50 years breeding experience. (Koolieoz 00:21, 11 May 2006 (UTC))

Just out of interest Tjupurka (Kerrie), how long have you been breeding Coolies (Koolies) and how far back do the records of lineage go for your foundation brood bitch and stud dog? Bonniebank 07:04, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Anne I've known, worked with and around German Coolies since 1985! That is way more than 18 months. How would you know how many members we have anyway? Prove there are only 2 members! For the record, the German Coolie Club of America has 225 members, American and Australian. We have 351 GERMAN COOLIES registered to date. The KCA ONLY has 3 American members;

The KCA has more than three members in America and is happy as the orginal and largest register of koolies to register those residing in America. Your records are facinating (Koolieoz 10:18, 15 May 2006 (UTC))

Yes, Anne, as is your registry information and the history behind some of the foundation dogs that are registered as "Pure Bred Koolies". l found the following info about the history of collies. Thought it may be of interest.

"It is thought that the Collie's ancestors arrived in Ireland between the 5. and 1. centuries BC. They were brought over by Celtic tribes. Some tribes also moved to Great Britain and brought their dogs with them. In Scotland sheep were more popular than in Ireland (where cattle was on first place) as they could be kept on more inhospitable, sparse terrain - so a good herding dog was invaluable to herd sheep over long distance, to find strays and to be a reliable worker even in hostile conditions and surroundings."

This refers to collies being 'bought over' by celts. Celts also occupied what is now Germany so it may be possible that the collie is also ancestor to herding breeds in Germany today. Also found " There are several origins for the word "collie": 1. Gaelic word collie meaning "useful" 2. Welsh word coelius meaning "loyal" 3. Scottish breed of sheep colley 4. the most simple solution - from word coalley meaning "black

My comment removedRangerDanielBoone (talk) 08:39, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Artorius, it would be nice to be so simple. The fact is it is an Australian breed, many assume of collie origin but there is more than one ancestor to each breed. There are Koolies in America but they arrived from Australia, often with imports or marino sheep which was quite extensive. Australias quarantine laws at that time would not allow the return of domestic animals once they had left the country (particularly from rabies suffering countries) so the dogs used while transporting would have been sold or traded before return. (Such was the fate of many thousands of Waler horses after World War 1 who were shot). Also our club patron who has bred koolies for 50 years has exported several times to America as have other members since. Yes the breed was known as German Koolie/Coolie but there is no breed by that name in Germany. When the club was formed obviously one single spelling had to be agreed upon, coolie is often confused with collie and at the same time we wished to indicate the club was Australian. German Koolie Club of Australia would only be very confusing. Research undertaken since the formation of the club found there is a very similar breed of farm working dog called the Tiger in Germany. Their breeders are adamant they are not of collie origins and are an ancient shepherd. Indications at this time is that the breed evolved in Australia between collies of the blue merles collies referred to behind kelpies and Australia Cattle Dogs and Tiger dogs that came with immigrant farmers from Germany in the early 1800's. There are many historical references to German farmers settling in various parts of Australia and of early Marino sheep breeders going to Germany and purchasing large flocks of sheep, it is fair to assume some would have returned with local dogs purchased at the time to herd the sheep which were bought all across the country. (Koolieoz 09:30, 12 May 2006 (UTC))

According to the Australian Merino by CJ Massey, the sheep industry was very stop and start getting going, the original sheep to arrive were meat type, the sheep to arrive with the first fleet were a small number of meat sheep, half of which died very early. The fleece sheep Merino industry took several decades to get going and they struggle to get good quality fleeces. Early merino sheep were imported from South Africa, but also England, France & Saxony (Germany). A lady by the name of Eliza Furlonge walked the breadth of Saxony purchasing sheep and collecting them together to transport back to Australia in 1829, there is every chance as she drove them from Konigstein to Hamburg for shipping that she had collected local sheep herding dogs to make the journey. There is no reason why several different imports of Tiger dogs happened and more could have come with immigrants over several decades, also we know some came back after the first world war with soldiers returning to their farms. (Koolieoz 10:18, 15 May 2006 (UTC))

Eliza Furlonge was actually a Scottish wool expert and the sheep she collected were the very rare Escorial sheep. She shipped them from Hamburg to Hull in Scotland, so if you are working on assumptions, then one can assume that she collected local sheep dogs from Scotland to help herd the sheep.--Artorius 06:45, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes she collected sheep across Saxony on foot, drove them to Hamburg, shipped them to Scotland, sold the flock twice before returning for a third time and then shipped them on to Australia where she is credited with a major roll in the early Merino sheep industry which now has a medal that it presents in her memory for services to the wool industry. (Koolieoz 10:29, 16 May 2006 (UTC))

Where is the proof? You "believe" or "assume" is NOT proof. Where is anything written in the historical achives about the herding dogs used, brought over, exported, imported, etc...? If you can't prove it, then don't assume it.

Vandalisim

Quote: This page is being vandalised by someone with personal agenda's and not for the good of Wikipedia or the Koolie so I have reverted it to the last serious content (Koolieoz 17:30, 9 May 2006 (UTC))

My two cents worth - No one person or organisation has god given rights to publish information and research. I am intersted in the Koolie or Coolie my self and wish to read any information that has been entered, people have the right to make their own judgements and form their own ideas. It is good - that even if it has been edited that the edited peices can be still read, as it is a free world and we have the right to be subjected to as much info as possible.

My thoughts exactly! :o) My only agenda is to learn more about these lovely dogs! I think this site is terrific in that it's very democratic. :o) I do know and/or know of some of the contributors to this page and openly admit that I have had dealings with a few of them. I'm not sure of the rules here so is it best if I make a disclaimer about any details as to my involvement with anyone???

I'd rather not bring personal issues into it but if the rules are that I have to disclose them before I can join in the discussion, please let me know.

I'm sorry if I've broken any rules by asking my question of Tjupurka. Bonniebank 11:27, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

My reference to the vandalism undertaken was in regard to whole paragraphs of information such as temperament etc. being removed completely. This is not the place for personal issues but a place for people to learn about the Koolie dog, the information is not supplied by one person only. (Koolieoz 15:49, 11 May 2006 (UTC))

But it's okay for Kerrie and you to remove the information from the American German Coolie Club?? By you and/or Kerrie removing the valid information from the American German Coolie Club that is vandalism. The members of the GCCA kindly ask that you cease from removing the information about the German Coolie's that are in the USA. Why is ANY information removed unless it can be proven that it is definitely wrong? Is the German Coolie/Coolie/koolie related in any way to the GSD? Just out of interest Tjupurka (Kerrie), how long have you been breeding Coolies (Koolies) and how far back do the records of lineage go for your foundation brood bitch and stud dog? (Bonniebank 11:29, 12 May 2006 (UTC))

Bonniebank, though this is an old comment, I want to point out that Wiki's concept is to not allow ANY info which is not verifiable, so the burden of proof is upon the person providing that info. It's not a matter of proving that it is definitely wrong. It's a matter of YOU proving that it is definitely Right. --JT (talk) 17:33, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Marino?????

Would it be possible to at least spell the breed of sheep this country once rode on the back of, correctly eg: MERINO this is a reference page after all. I find it offensive that "researchers" cannot even take the time to be literate.

Sorry to offend you by a spelling error, if you google marino many people use it. This is a place to share knowledge, not personal attacks and agendas. Also good etiquet dictates signing your comments. (Koolieoz 10:18, 15 May 2006 (UTC))

Many people may use 'Marino' when referring to San Marino but if we're talking about the sheep breed you'll actually find that 'Merino' is the correct spelling. 'Etiquet'? Do you mean 'etiquette'

If you google "MERINO", you will find that the breed name is spelled, "MERINO", not MARINO.

Removal of Articles published by American German Coolie Club

Please refer to guide lines governing publishing in the Wikipedia. Information can be located upon linked website of American German Coolie so therefore unnecessary to display here. Suggestion: Information gathered from American German Coolie states that they believe their breed the German Coolie is a separate breed from the Australian Koolie, if this is the case then please publish upon your own page, and stop interfering with the Koolie stub. This issue has been referred to the controlling Committee of the Wikipedia.(Tjukurpa 00:29, 15 May 2006 (UTC))

Kerrie please stop deleting the information put up by the American German Coolie Club. If you do not cease vandalizing the information, warnings will be given and then a request to the Administration to lock the page will be made. Information can also be gathered from the KCA website, so linking to it should be the only information required, also. This is a public information media and not to be used for your personal advertisment. I have also referred comments to the Committee of the Wikipedia. I am not interferring with anything. The public has the right to read about the German Coolies that are in America without your permission as to what is written. Kerrie, Please refer to guide lines governing publishing in the Wikipedia. This is a PUBLIC media and welcomes information from other sources other than the KCA. ANY ONE can contribute to the information for this and any other article.

Removal of piece by American german coolie register from health section, was argumentative, not of a neutral nature and opinionated. (Tjukurpa 22:56, 24 May 2006 (UTC))

Edited comments & replace information

Comments referring to Associate register has no relevance on Koolie page. Alternative names for the Koolie are a factual historical part of the Koolie researched, discovered, recorded and submited by the Koolie Club of Australia (Tjukurpa 00:50, 15 May 2006 (UTC))

The comments are most definitely relevent to any Coolie owner wishing to trial their Coolie in any ANKC organised dog sport, given that it presents them with an alternative other than having to join the Koolie Club simply for their dog to be eligible to be placed on an ANKC register. This article is supposedly a source of information for the public and the public has a right to decide what is relevent to them, NOT what is only relevent to the KCA. The factual, historical alternate names for the Coolie were "discovered" LONG BEFORE the KCA was ever in existence. To state as above that they were "discovered" by the KCA is grossly misleading and should be removed.

Just out of interest Tjupurka, how long have you been breeding Coolies (Koolies) and how far back do the records of lineage go for your foundation brood bitch and stud dog? Bonniebank 03:54, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Is this an article on the Koolie or the Koolie Club of Australia? I am interested in reading about the breed not the club.

Romaval of item related to American working clubs there is no source, no links to these club in order to verify this statement.(Tjukurpa 03:57, 17 May 2006 (UTC))

They are linked now, just for you. Thanks so much for bringing that to my attention. What source is the "Temperament" derived from? Does any of Geoff Broughton, the president of the KCA, dogs actually work livestock, or are they just pets? He is cited for providing the information on the working style of the Koolie. Just wondering where he gathered his information from? Is this his opinion, or is he an authority on working dogs? Has he written any books or articles on the working dog? Does he train working dogs for the public, trials, or stations? Does he trial his dogs? Is he a trial judge for working dogs?

Removal of personal link, please refer to neutral point of view guide lines (Tjukurpa 08:38, 19 May 2006 (UTC))

Kerrie it was not a personal link, it was linked directly to the forum. It will be put back up on a continual basis. It's linked to the FORUM, not her site.

To whom it may concern- l have removed comments made by me using past user names Barrakee and Artorius. RangerDanielBoone (talk) 08:37, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Removal of article from health section of Koolie page

This peice has no source nor does it show any relevence to the Koolie breed.(Tjukurpa 02:42, 17 May 2006 (UTC))

The piece does have a source, is linked, and is relevant to the Coolie breed. It has the same relevance as the health piece from the KCA.

Removal of vandalisms and personal attacks from health section, keep your articles neutral. Edited sporting register piece to include links to forms for membership to both Sporting registrar and associate registrar of the VCA and general tidy up.(Tjukurpa 03:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC))

To the person or people who are not signing their comments, please refer to the Wikipedia guidelines. It is generally accepted that people placing articles also support their pieces by including ones identity with their comments. (Tjukurpa 03:30, 24 May 2006 (UTC))

Etiquette

Sorry I did not know how to put my name in, I am just someone interested in Dogs thats all. Not sure what you mean about personal attacks though? Surely correct spelling is important considering this is page for reference and research???? Dogsmum

Dogsmum, sorry again for some phonetic (is that right?) spelling, but this is just a discussion page regarding the article, for a decade or 2 our schools happily taught phonetically and I think we are now paying the price. Does that overshadow the information one might have to share with others though? If you look to the bottom of this page you will see the instructions on how to include your signature, others post personal comments and then don't even attach their name as you have let alone sign the comment. Also at the bottom of this page is a link to policies and guidelines which others should be reading that continue to make personal comments when this is a discussion on the article. I hope this spelling is OK (Koolieoz 10:29, 16 May 2006 (UTC))

==Guidelines from Wikipedia== [1] I feel you all need to read this information before you continue. It covers the three cardinal guide lines of the Wikipedia 1.Original research.(what it is and why it's not allowed) 2.Site your source 3.Nutural point of view If the sandpit attitude continues the page could be locked or worse deleted. If you have disputes then go to the dispute page and put forth your dispute. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution If your views differ make you own page. Your articles will continue to be edited until they conform to these guide lines, site your source, so your articles can be authenticated. Keep your opinions, smart remarks and personal attacks to yourself, this not a public forum or private email. This page is being monitored. (Tjukurpa 02:11, 17 May 2006 (UTC))

May I suggest Tjupurka that you follow your own advice. My entry regarding the associate register is relevent to Koolie owners. They are entitled to be informed of all the options if they wish to trial their Koolie. My source is the ANKC (a reliable one I should have thought). If you believe it to be totally irrelevent to Koolie owners then please state why. Perhaps you are unaware of a primary rule of thumb of Wikipedia and that is: If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly or redistributed by others, do not submit it. Could you explain to me what you say is a "nutural" point of view? I'm sorry. I haven't heard that expression before. Thank you for the advice about reporting a dispute. I will be reporting and requesting a warning to anyone who removes any of my editing unless it can be proven that it is malicious or in no way pertains to Koolies.

You state that the contributions to the article were made by members of the KCA. Well I am a member. None of the contributions were made on my behalf nor was I ever consulted about this article. Therefore I conclude that the contributions were submitted by certain members of the KCA but can in no way be considered as being made on behalf of the KCA. Are contributions being accepted only from certain members or can all members have their say? If the latter is the case, then why are my contributions deleted? Personally, I would like to see this article deleted altogether if it is to be non-democratic. In order to learn more about these dogs and major contributors to the article and discussion I have been asking 3 simple questions but not receiving an answer. Again I ask: Why is ANY information removed unless it can be proven that it is definitely wrong? Is the German Coolie/Coolie/koolie related in any way to the GSD? Just out of interest Tjupurka, how long have you been breeding Coolies (Koolies) and how far back do the records of lineage go for your foundation brood bitch and stud dog? As for your comment regarding personal attacks, I wouldn't want anyone to think that this is why I'm interested in this article and wish to contribute to it. I'm not sure but is it a requirement on here that we should disclose any personal relationships with other contributors and what was entailed in them? I have deliberately tried to avoid any personal conflict and just want to help contribute to this article but if it is a requirement, please let me know and I'll gladly abide by the requirement. Koolieoz, please state your source that schools in Australia have taught phonetic spelling for 10-20 years. I contacted Dept Education in all states and was informed they have NEVER "taught" phonetic spelling (only made students aware of that type of spelling used in other countries such as USA). If my contributions to this article are to be continually deleted and anyone interested in the article would care to hear them, please feel free to contact me via email at Bonniebank2@bigpond.com

IMHO, a potential owner of ANY breed is entitled to gain as much info as they can then make up their own minds. Bonniebank 15:15, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

To whom it may concern- l have removed comments made by me using past user names Barrakee and Artorius. RangerDanielBoone (talk) 08:41, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

To quote you Tjupurka, "site your source, so your articles can be authenticated." So what is your source regarding the involvement of the German Tiger in the German Coolie/Coolie/Koolie "breed"? Is it verified or heresay and assumptions? If it is verified, by whom? I notice that the "source has not been sited" for several comments in the article other than to say that they were contributed by members of the Koolie Club. To quote you again Tjupurka, "If you have disputes then go to the dispute page and put forth your dispute". Perhaps you should follow your own advice? ANY article can be disputed. That's the beauty of this site. To quote you again Tjupurka, "If your views differ make you own page". Now I really AM confused. Is this page for exclusive usage or is it meant to be an open and honest page providing a source of research for those who are interested in German Coolies/Coolies/Koolies? Call them whatever you will, NONE of them are a recognised breed and are technically a CROSSBREED. From what I can gather, the only difference appears to be the name and what the dogs have been CROSSED with in recent years. If there is no "breed" recognition, then effectively what you have here are MUTTS. Plain and simple. If, (as has been stated on here) the Koolie Club have no aspirations to have the "breed" recognised, then why do "they" bother to list any conformation details at all? The "club" then contradicts "itself" by stating that the description is "based on it's ability to work". I assume this page was created for anyone who wants to learn and know more about these dogs and yet still my questions have not been answered. Not a good image for the club I would think. I ask AGAIN: 1. Why is ANY information removed unless it can be proven that it is definitely wrong? 2. Is the German Coolie/Coolie/koolie related in any way to the GSD? 3. I'm not sure but is it a requirement on here that we should disclose any personal relationships with other contributors and what was entailed in them? I have deliberately tried to avoid any personal conflict and just want to help contribute to this article but if it is a requirement, please let me know and I'll gladly abide by the requirement. 4. Koolieoz, please state your source that schools in Australia have taught phonetic spelling for 10-20 years. I contacted Dept Education in all states and was informed they have NEVER "taught" phonetic spelling (only made students aware of that type of spelling used in other countries such as USA). 5. You appear to be very knowledgeable Tjupurka. How long have you been breeding Coolies (Koolies) and how far back do the records of lineage go for your foundation brood bitch and stud dog? 6. The Three Revert Rule forbids the use of reverts in repetitive succession. Does this apply to EVERYONE? BTW, I didn't expect such a huge response to my invitation to email me privately. Thank you to those who have and I promise to reply within the next couple of days. :o)Bonniebank 13:12, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Edit needed....

...to conform with the (so far) generally accepted and admittedly loose policy of the Dog Project.

I'm going to edit out bias and a couple of guote marks, and move material to the relevant headings, i.e. the right paragraph, and make the style more encyclopedic. Maybe not today, but soon.

This is not the place for a dogfight, folks (you should forgive the pun). May I suggest that you write articles on the Koolie Club of Australia and the German Coolie Club of America if you are so inclined?

I suggest that, if there is a difference between the strain, the development, or the goal of the Koolie (Australian) and the German Coolie of America, that we make a separate chapter to discuss, and/or start a new article on the American dog. Quill 05:34, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your input and guidance Quill, we appreciate any assistance you can give.

A seperate page for the American club was suggested, but I feel that our rather limited knowledge of the workings of the Wikipedia is a handicap, if you would be so generous as to explain this chapter option, possibly this could be a solution.(Tjukurpa 06:23, 28 May 2006 (UTC))

Well, I'm going to have a look at the main article now and see how it's shaping up. This entry should be a breed article, not a club article. Of course, the position of the two clubs can be presented, even if controversial, as long as the entries are presented without bias (read that as 'with as little bias as possible'). My gut feeling is that we don't really need separate articles here; see below. As to 'chapter', I just meant different section headings. Quill 10:01, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Just a small thing, folks--if you will use a colon (:) at the beginning of a reply, it will indent and we can tell who wrote what. Each successive person uses an additional colon. I've fixed this, and as you will see when you 'edit', my reply here has three colons in front of it.

(Add the same number of colons in front of each new paragraph, and again when you sign your name to the whole sh-bang.

Yes, Artorius, I realize this isn't an article for the Koolie Club of Australia, it's the main breed article. I was suggesting that you write an article on the German Coolie Club if you wished, and Tjukurpa could write one on the Koolie Club of Australia. Or, if everyone could remain civil, both clubs could simply be mentioned in this article. There isn't really a reason to write a whole article on a breed club unless it has a very illustrious history or a unique position of some sort, if that makes sense to you.

Quill 10:01, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Early 18th Century?

"Koolies have existed in Australia since the early 18th century."- I'm assuming this is a typo, since Australia wasn't settled until 1788. Kiwifruitboi 12:40, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Tone

This article is not up to standard - it needs mericiless editing of the unencylopediac style SatuSuro 14:11, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Hello not being a professional and only wishing to record the history of the Australian Koolie, much of which is still being discovered and/or created, I have styled the Koolie page very closely on many other breed pages that I have read in Wikipedia, including the featured ones.

I hope that it has been noticed the recent amount of work to improve this article proves we are very serious about providing quality information.

If you would be so kind as to define, specify or clarify which particular parts of this article you feel need to be worked on, possibly direct me to an actual article where I could see an example of the style/tone of which you refer, this would be appreciated.

As the article has been accepted as started, Wikipedia must have seen some potential , I shall endeavour to continue learning from the standards set within Wikipedia itself and offering my best contribution(I have read the help section of creating an artical.Tjukurpa (talk) 08:59, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

• Dog breeds task force Recommended article structure

• Wikipedia:Annotated article is a well-constructed article, with annotations that explain why.

• Wikipedia:Citing sources explains process and standards for citing references in articles.

HTH, --Hafwyn (talk) 23:05, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your helpful suggestion and advice.

I have downloaded these examples and know they shall strengthen my understanding of what is required to improve my input in the article Tjukurpa (talk) 05:10, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Koolie Club of Australia

The article Koolie Club of Australia has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

A search for references found only a minor mention of the subject in published (gBooks) works. Fails WP:N and WP:V

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Jeepday (talk) 16:59, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Koolie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20140304014630/http://koolie.net:80/exons/index.php? to http://koolie.net/exons/index.php?

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External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to one external link on Koolie. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20160206154323/http://asaplab.com.au/dnatesting/ to http://asaplab.com.au/dnatesting/

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Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Koolie/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

I have removed these comments and placed them here so as not to clutter up the main Koolie page Tjukurpa (talk) 00:43, 13 May 2008 (UTC) The article has lots of information about the subject and has met the requirements for B-Class. However, the article is in dire need of inline citations to verify the information on the subject. Also, the article needs to by copyedited.Coaster1983 (talk) 04:26, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Last edited at 02:19, 30 August 2009 (UTC). Substituted at 21:22, 29 April 2016 (UTC)