Talk:Kuban bridgehead

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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): S.R. Summerfield.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 23:45, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Infobox

More additions can be made to the Infobox. Especially commanders and unit sizes, I'm having difficultly finding reliable sources for this part. Also what should the result show as? Currently I've put down "Successful German withdrawal" but this might be problematic as Soviets won the ground. S.R. Summerfield (talk) 21:06, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

More Soviet Sources and Perspectives Needed

Most of this article seems to have a German focus at the moment. I am having difficulty finding information about Soviet forces participating in this action. I can look at English sources and most German, but the information (and there isn't much) in both these languages doesn't focus on the Soviets. If someone could do further research into this it would help round the article out. Thanks! S.R. Summerfield (talk) 04:41, 14 January 2016 (UTC)

To help with the perspective, I suggest removing section "Major German Operations" -- they reflect the German POV and come from a book on German awards (i.e. militaria literature), rather than from a historian. Also, the language in the descriptions of the battles reflect German POV -- "defense" of such and such a town, etc. Please let me know if there are any concerns. K.e.coffman (talk) 23:16, 19 February 2016 (UTC)

I included the section on "Major German Operations" in an attempt to add further depth to the article, hoping a similar section could be made for the Soviets. I agree its inclusion may be problematic, especially given Kurt-Gerhard Klietmann is not a historian. I brought it over from a German Language article thinking it could be further expanded upon.

I'd still like to include descriptions of large operations that occurred, both German and Soviet, but you are correct about the wording and especially the source. The Historiography of the Eastern Front tends to be very German oriented, although this is slowly changing, and I'm glad you've addressed it. Do we want to create a sub section outlining operations of both sides, or remove it entirely from the article? S.R. Summerfield (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 14:18, 23 February 2016 (UTC)

Okay, I will go ahead and remove.

I don't think the objective should be to remove it but rather to expand upon soviet operations.S.R. Summerfield (talk) 23:59, 9 March 2016 (UTC)

I'm not sure that the source "Awards of the German Reich" is quite WP:RS for military operations. What is Motorbuch Verlag -- is it academically leaning publishing house, or provider of "militaria literature"? K.e.coffman (talk) 05:40, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

I've located a source that deals directly with the Kuban bridgehead: "The Defence and Evacuation of the Kuban Bridgehead, January – October 1943". It's a master's thesis, but probably the best that can be found at this point. K.e.coffman (talk) 02:41, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Lead Section Question

The Lead Section has the sentence "Existing from January to October 1943, the bridgehead formed after the Germans were pushed out of the Caucasus." With "Germans were pushed out" linking to the Battle of the Caucasus. But from my understanding, Army Group A, that was the army group in charge of going down into the Caucasus to get the oil and was the one fighting the Battle of the Caucasus, was actually evacuated because part of the Army Group B, specifically the 6th Army and part of the 4th Panzer Army was encircled at Stalingrad in Operation Uranus and then Army Group A was at risk of being cut off because of Operation Little Saturn. So they didn't get pushed out because of the Battle of the Caucasus, they had to evacuate because they were at risk of getting cut off after part of Army Group B was crushed and the rest had to retreat. Alexysun (talk) 05:10, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Actually it seems like Operation Little Saturn created the Kuban bridgehead. Alexysun (talk) 05:12, 7 April 2022 (UTC)