Talk:Led Zeppelin/Archive 1

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Restored Posts

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An event in this article is a January 12 selected anniversary

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I don't think that the information about the band's formation is right. I believe that Page and Jones first started the band and then recruited Robert Plant. And finally, Plant reccomended Bonham to finish out the band. Although Page considered Dreja but I have never heard of them acctually playing together. If any external information confirming the current wikipedia page can be found then great. But after today, since it's easter, I'm going to start working on compiling information on what I believe to be the correct version of the band's formation, so that my eventual update will be Wikipedia quality. - Michael J. McGuirk

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By the release of "Presence" and the disappointing "In Through the Out Door"

Begging your pardon, but I would have written it the other way. I find "Presence" rather disappointing (well, to be frank, unlistenable) but am quite pleased with "In Through the Out Door." Critics at the time weren't unanimous in calling it a step down, either, as most of them were unimpressed with the previous efforts also. Critics now are not unanimous in calling it a step down, as there are such a wide variety of critics in such divergent fields writing on music of the 70s. Perhaps the comment should be made much more specific or removed altogether. --KQ

When "In Through the out door" was released, at least a few in my neighborhood (heh Teter Quad) were incensed by the "disco" influence. We hated it! In retrospect, I would have to agree with KQ, "Presence" fell flat and ITTOD is a much better work.

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Critics, shmitics. BOTH ITTOD and Presence are solid records, reflecting the varied tastes of the band. Recorded mostly live in studio, Presence simply rocks. Maybe it's one of the unsung proto-punk albums of the 70s. You can be sure the Meat Puppets dug it.

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When people "choke on their own vomit" what happens is that the autonomous nervous system shuts down. If you threw up in your sleep, it would wake you up sputtering, but if you are in a coma, the mechanism doesn't work. I just performed the same service for Bonham that I earlier performed for Hendrix, removing this popular phrase and replacing it with "died in a coma" which is what really happened. Going back now to italicize album titles. Ortolan88 18:30 Aug 20, 2002 (PDT)

Besides, when did anyone ever choke on somebody else's vomit? Graham 00:09, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

I believe that happened to one of Spinal Tap's drummers!!User:Zoso Jade 15:37, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)

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After those concerts the name was changed to Led Zeppelin after Keith Moon, drummer with The Who, suggested they would "go over like a lead balloon".

In a television program yesterday I heard a variation of this story. According to this version Jimmy Page had a conversation with John Lennon. Lennon apparently said that Page's band "wasn't going to come off the ground, just like a lead zeppelin." I have no clue as to which version is the right one, though. D.D. 10:13 Feb 1, 2003 (UTC)

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I don't agree with the current revisions by Jgm. It is extremely negative seeming to concentrate on the so-called "curse" and other "excesses". I am a Led Zeppelin fan and don't believe in superstition - blaming witchcraft for eveything that goes wrong is something that happened in the Dark Ages, not the 21st century. People have accidents everyday, it has nothing to do with curses. Nobody would say Elvis's death was caused by the occult. It looks like the same sensationalist gutter-sniping written up by Stephen Davis and Richard Cole (two authors that should be avoided at all costs). Also the period which is described as "The Curse" was a very productive one for the band. Fans refer to it as the "Power & Glory" era not "the curse" era. Box office records were broken and record sales were still going through the roof. I also don't believe punk music was as popular as the press made it out to be. Most of it was generated by pure hype and Malcolm McLaren milked it for it was worth. Led Zeppelin were still out-selling the Sex Pistols even if people hated In Through the Out Door - Leanne

My edit was a cleaning up of the additions made just before me by a big fan of the band. I downplayed and NPOV'd the "curse" as much as I could without eliminating mention of it -- it is part of the band's legend and makes an interesting way to frame the darker days of the band. It might not be appropriate for a section header; feel free to change that if you can think of something better. I agree with your statement about punk rock and made a slight change to reflect it as a change in critical more than popular focus.

Jgm 12:29, 31 Aug 2003 (UTC)

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Comments about this article from user at 129.78.64.101, moved from my user page:

You wrote: "deleted inaccurate/redundant item, DVD had different name from CD"

Are you a Led Zeppelin fan or not? The DVD-Audio version is being released this month of How the West was Won. It is a multimedia version which includes extra songs and images not included in the How the West was Won CD. There is a difference.

If you don't believe me read this page:

http://www.led-zeppelin.com/news/news_dvdaudio.html

I'm restoring the edit

Please use neutral language in your edits. It is Wikipedia policy to reach for a NPOV in articles. ---

I've restored much of the framing information deleted by the user at 129.78.64.101, hopefully in a more NPOV way that will be mutually acceptable. The intent here isn't fan advocacy or whitewashing the band's history. LZ was famous for its excesses -- whole books have been written about it -- and mentioning it in a NPOV way in a single paragraph is entirely appropriate and perhaps even a bit charitable. Likewise, the fact that fans discussed a "curse" is just that; the current edit is not claiming that the curse was real.

Re: "darker days" vs. "latter days" -- I think a period marked by at least three deaths related to the band is fairly characterized as "dark". NPOV does not mean no interesting language.

Finally, I've clarified the issue about the DVD-Audio release, hope this is acceptable.

No it's not acceptable. You removed a perfectly legitimate link without even doing an iota of research on it, based on your own incorrect uninformed opinion that the DVD didnt exist. If you don't know anything about the band Led Zeppelin you shouldn't be editing this article.

If you have further issues with this edit let's discuss here rather than fight an edit battle, please. Jgm 02:52, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

You didnt reframe it - all you did was restore what you had previously written. You could at least be honest about it. I have tracked down the history of edits. Most of garbage about curses and drug addiction was added by you Jgm, no-one else, so it's hardly been a consensus when you refer to the Talk page. It is Wikipedia policy to reach for a NPOV in an article. Language such as "dark" or "cursed" are opinions, but not neutral ones. John Paul Jones was hardly a heavy drug or alcohol user so the generalisation that they were is questionable on that paragraph.

• I replaced some sentences verbatim, attempted to make others more neutral (for example, the factual statement that some critics considered the band dinosaurs in the burgeoning days of New Wave was countered by the fact that the album reached #1 on the basis of fan support). All of the original information about a "curse" was added by the editor prior to me, I NPOV'd it significantly while respecting the content that contributor added. Jgm 03:16, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

And if it is wrong, as it is, it should be removed regardless if it is by a previous editor or not. Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia not a message board. Btw in a previous edit you had written that John Paul Jones was the drummer. Another editor changed it before I could. How much do you really know about the band? I'm beginning to suspect not a lot.

Similarly, people die every day, that does not mean that every day is dark. Many of those were accidents or caused by their own personal problems - they had nothing to do directly with the band. Moon died after taking an accidental overdose - does mean the Who were cursed? No-one has suggested that yet Zeppelin get blamed for it. Similarly, Bonham's death was an accident, and Zeppelin can hardly be blamed for the death of Karac when he died of a stomach virus thousands of miles away in England when the band were in the US.

• C'mon -- of course people die every day, but if 3 people in your family die in a year, that's a "dark" year for your family. Blame or causation has nothing to do with it. Neither my previous edit nor the current, possibly more nuetral edit claim that the curse is real, nor that anyone is to blame for the tragedies; the current edit reads that some fans discussed a curse -- this is undoubtably true, as evidenced by the fan who wrote the edit prior to mine, as well as the recollections of many of us who lived through it. Jgm 03:44, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

But thats' it. They weren't three members in a family and they were hardly related. Moon, Bonham, and Karac Plant weren't related. True because a "fan" before you wrote it? That's the weakest argument I've seen in a long time. That passage could have been written by anybody who didn't like the band.

If you dont want an edit war, remove the opinionated garbage about the band. Who cares what was written by some has been hack about the band. The fact is Led Zeppelin have publicly disowned many the statements made in those books. Just because someone knew the members of the band does not mean they are saying the truth. None of the rags published by Stephen Davis, Richard Cole or Pamela DesBarres has ever been approved of by the band and in fact the remaining members have threatened suit. If you dont want an edit war, remove the opinionated garbage about the band. Who cares what was written by some has been hack about the band. The fact is Led Zeppelin have publicly disowned many the statements made in those books. Just because someone knew the members of the band does not mean they are saying the truth. None of the rags published by Stephen Davis, Richard Cole or Pamela DesBarres has ever been approved of by the band and in fact the remaining members have threatened suit.

• None of the particular claims from the books you mention are cited in the article. Your opinion of the books you cite (you named them, not I), or the band's "approval" of them is not really pertinent. Nevertheless, it is fact that the band -- even at the time, prior to the publication of any books -- was famous for excess, including the types of excess mentioned. If you can find a more neutral way to present this information, go for it, but you can't just edit out the parts you'd rather not be mentioned. Also, please sign your contributions here for clarity. Jgm 03:44, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

That's the problem, you say please write in a neutral way yet you still revert the edits back to your own which is not neutral to begin with, for instance the historical fact the Dixon lawsuit was 25 years after those two songs were recorded. That should be important to note. If Dixon truely believed he should have been given credit he should have started the lawsuit back in 1971, yet anyone reading the article with no knowledge of Led Zeppelin (a bit like yourself) would think he sued right away. It is a historical fact yet you removed it. Someone should tell you that you don't own the article. There appears to be no concensus with you. Anything that removes or edits out anything you say is reverted back. If you cannot allow others to write NPOV over your edits then the only solution would be to make a formal complaint about you to an admin. Clearly removing chronologically neutral titles like "Latter Days" and "Coda" back to your own "Darker Days" and "The Fall" is not going to win you many arguments. Please also refrain from the excuse, "but the editor before me did it". If the editor before you did it you wouldnt be defending the reverts so vigourously. Everyone knows including yourself that your edit history can be seen. It is not your article period and you should stop trying to make it your own because it will win you no friends with the hierarchy.

Actually I have not reverted the header titles; I quite like "Coda" especially. I still think "Darker days" is appropriate and more interesting, but, as you say, it's not my article.Jgm 07:23, 17 Oct 2003 (UTC)

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I don't necessarily agree. The band never called themselves "heavy metal" and one listen of Led Zeppelin III is proof enough that trying to class them as purely "heavy metal" is fraught with difficulty. I have contributed to the heavy metal article, but my view is Blue Cheer and Black Sabbath, with their use of excessive volume, distortion and formulaic sound are definitely "heavy metal". Both bands lack that variation and subtlety that Led Zeppelin had. Personally i would class Led Zeppelin simply as Classic Rock. For example, how do you class "Tangerine" and "Black Mountain Side" as blues or hard rock or heavy metal? Iam 23:02, Sep 29, 2004 (UTC)

In addition to some copyedits, I've changed the first description of the band from "blues/rock" to "heavy metal". An LZ article that never mentions heavy metal is simply unforgivable, in my view (the heavy metal article credits LZ as one of the original heavy metal acts). While the description "blues/rock" is also accurate, the band is more famous as a heavy metal icon, and "heavy blues" is even more accurate and is mentioned in the first sentence. Jgm 00:01, 27 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Deep Purple Reference

Removed the grotesquely worded non-sequitur discussion of "Led Zeppelin were often called "the first heavy rock band" and the subsequent non-debate of whether Deep Purple was more deserving of such a title. The passage was POV and fairly irrelevant.

Jones's name

Just saw that it is already included in the John Paul Jones Page. Look's like this case is already settled. --Johnnyw 15:40, 18 May 2005 (UTC)

Yes, had heard that about the name being suggested to him. So is, for example, his passport under John Baldwin? I am still curious as it would therefore be strange for his wife to be known as Mo Jones. That said, it might be even stranger for her to be known as Mo Baldwin despite being married to John Paul Jones! --HighHopes 19:59, 19 May 2005 (UTC)

Actually I can confirm that it is a pseudonym. His birth name is John Baldwin (his father is Joe Baldwin). "The name John Paul Jones was suggested to him by a friend, Andrew Loog Oldham, after seeing a movie poster with that name on it in France" [1] I will include this info about John on the Led Zep wiki page and on the John Paul Jones page.. Also mentioned in [2] [3] [4] --Johnnyw 15:37, 18 May 2005 (UTC)

Can anyone confirm if John Paul Jones is a pseudonym or an actual name change? Album credits refer to his wife as Mo Jones; the article mentions his daughter as Jacinda Jones. If John Paul Jones is his actual name now, his family's names would make more sense. This point has also been raised on the page for John Paul Jones. --HighHopes 13:46, 15 May 2005 (UTC)

Presence

Recent edits chaned the desctipiton of Presence from (I paraphrase) "dire" to "wonderful". Neither is NPoV. Andy Mabbett 10:12, 13 Aug 2004 (UTC)

1975 MSG shows

The article had been claiming that the shows used for the movie The Song Remains the Same were filmed in '73; a recent edit says that 1975 footage (eventually released on the DVD) were used. From what I've been able to find out I don't think there was any overlap between the shows and tours used for the two projects. I've reverted for now, if we can find out for sure we need to correct consistently. Jgm 11:59, 29 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Led Zeppelin did perform at MSG in 1975, but the footage is not the same as the 1973 shows on the DVD. Only the 1973 shows appear, albeit briefly. Also, remember the band did film some shots, mostly close-ups, in 1974 on a "mock-up" of MSG back in England. Iam 23:06, Sep 29, 2004 (UTC)

D'Yer Mak'er misconeptions

Right now the article has some nonsense about Did you Make Her being English slang for sex and that being why Zeppelin named the song so. This is untrue. It's an old joke which goes:

First man: My wife and I just came back from the Caribean.| Second man: Jamaica?| First man: (mishearing his friend as having asked "d'yer make her?") No. She wanted to go.|

And that is where the name of the song came from. After writing such a reggae heavy song, trying to come up with a name, Zep thought "D'Yer Mak'er" would make a perfect subtle homage to Jamaica (considered the birth-place of reggae).

Anyway, I'm going to change the page now.

03:38, Nov 17, 2004 (UTC)Zoso Jade

Blues-Rock or Blues-Rock?

I'm changing the first link in the article to direct to Blues-Rock from Blues-Rock. Blues-Rock is a term/classificaton in wide use on "pro" databases like allmusic.com but for some reason Led Zeppelin (or Cream) aren't mentioned in the wikipedia article on Blues-Rock at this time. --apecat 13:30, 10 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Categories

What's the rationale for categorizing this article as Category:American musical groups ? — B.Bryant 23:25, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

What a rubbish!

Quoting ... "When adopting the name, the word 'lead' was misspelled deliberately to avoid confusion, fearing Americans might pronounce it 'lead Zeppelin' (as in 'lead singer'), as opposed to a zeppelin constructed of the metal lead."

?!?!?! What the FREAKING hell has this to do with Americans?? Oughtn't 'Americans' be replaced by 'people'?

• Any* English-speaking person might pronounce "lead" as "LEED" like in Leeds.

This wording definitely puts Americans in a very ridiculous light, because it suggests that only Americans would mis-pronounce it. ;) -andy 80.129.47.116 16:19, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Might be that anybody might mis-pronounce it, but what was the band thinking when they came up with it? If they did it because they felt that Americans might get it wrong then it has to stand. The band can't be expected to be NPOV. If however there is no evidence for that being their thinking then it needs to go. — KayEss | talk 16:26, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

It is probably that Americans pronounce many words different to the British and lead(ie LEED) is more likely to be said by Americans than other British who are more likely to have heard the correct pronunciation on British radio/T.V.. Tunney 23:30, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Until we see a reference I don't think there is any reason for Americans to be singled out in this article. I'm a big fan and have read numerous books and articles on the band and am familiar with their wishes not to have the name pronounced incorrectly. However, in none of the research I have done on the band have I heard the band were thinking about Americans in particular. I find the above argument that Americans were more likely to mispronounce it than the British to be completely baseless (on the contrary, Zeppelin famously had a better relationship with the American press than the British). This is likely the usual anti-American rubbish made up when someone changes a name (eg a similar falsehood was made up as a reason for naming the film adaptation of The Madness of George III, "The Madness of King George". According to (false) rumour it was so Americans wouldn't think it was a sequel.--Zoso Jade 14:45, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

I've read this in Stephen Davis's (admittedly inaccurate) book among several others. The info is accurate. Bcarlson33 23:01, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

I always thought it was cause 'Led' looks cooler then 'Lead'--KaptKos 14:55, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Mandolin

The article was edited to show Page played the mandolin and that Jones didn't - have reverted, as Jones was as likely to play mandolin in the studio (not that they used it much) and always played it live. Sure, Page used (Jones's) mandolin on Battle of Evermore, but then you could add 'guitar' next to JPJ - the opening to Celebration Day is him. Would be misleading, which also explains the revert. If you insist, take mandolin out altogether rather than move back to Page. --High (Hopes) 06:54, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)

VH1

My thought is that the VH1 thing doesn't belong in the lead; it is a made-for-TV thing and not really a recognized "honor" or historical milestone in the big picture. Can we discuss here, if not I will move the mention elsewhere in a day or so. Jgm 02:09, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Some consideration could be put in relating that Zeppelin was more of a "Live Act" than Studio as that was the only way fans could see Zeppelin because of the media shunning them.As well,the fact that their studio works may not be considered "Heavy Metal",when the songs were played live{Dazed,The Song Remains the Same,ect},it was the heaviest shit then and still heavier than some stuff now.

album sales

The article claims that Led Zeppelin is the 2nd highest selling band after the Beatles, which according to the Best Selling Artist list on wikipedia is clearly not true. I have no idea what the actual numbers are, but I am pretty sure Led Zeppelin is not number two.

Hm, I don't know if the info originates from a RIAA article that was up-to-date 2 years ago... This news article refers to a RIAA document which lists Led Zeppelin as 2nd best selling artists of all-time (US only). A more up to date list can be found here. This list too, is US only. All in all, I would say you are right, this info is inprecise if not incorrect. --Johnnyw 22:16, August 24, 2005 (UTC)

Article box : "The Song Remains the Same" V's "How the West Was Won"

In the Led Zeppelin article box at the bottom of every Zep article it has:

The Song Remains the Same under "Original albums"

V's

How the West Was Won under "Other albums"

Aren't these comparatively the same thing? Live albums done when the band was touring in the 70's?

Maybe "Original" should be "Studio" and The Song Remains the Same moved to "Other"?

WikiDon 00:26, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

===>Likely rationale The Song Remains the Same was recorded and released while the band was still functioning, whereas How the West Was Won was released over 20 years after they had ceased to be. Justin (koavf) 03:58, September 2, 2005 (UTC)

Wow! So Much Missing

Here's just a FEW of the things that, far as I can tell, this article COMPLETELY misses.

LZ and the groupies. This is huge. Page is rumored to have had a 15 year old 'girlfriend' for quite awhile and their antics are rock scene legendary even memorialized in Zappa's classic Live at the Filmore back in 1971.

LZ and satanic images. I can understand the reluctance of zep fanatics to include material such as this, but it's very important to the overall record, much in the same way the whole "Paul is Dead" issue should be included in any comprehensive piece on The Beatles. Page was apparently enamored with Alistar Crowley and even perhaps Anton Levay. (sp?) When the 'backward masking' issue arose, Stairway to Heaven was found to be a chief culprit. There's a whole lot of material on this topic that ought to be covered. I'm a big Zep fan, but you can't just sugarcoat everything.

Also, missing was how SAVAGED they were by most 'professional' rock critics, especially Rolling Stone Magazine, which makes 'Almost Famous's' use of an LZ tune especially ironic.

LZ are frequently accused of flat out RIPPING OFF old school blues legends without giving them proper attribution and these charges are almost certainly legit. (Although, personally I'm quite glad they did! :) In fact, I think the caretakers of Robert Johnson's estate actually won some kind of settlement. Big Daddy 18:39, 15 September 2005 (UTC)

I've dug up some stuff. Amazing stuff. First of all Jimmy Page's girlfriend wasn't 15. She was 14! My deepest apologies to her. She was then 14-year-old “supergroupie” Lori Maddox. Check out this link for the support - http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,21132-1549424,00.html more to come! Big Daddy 11:54, 1 October 2005 (UTC)

Stairway to Heaven

"Stairway to Heaven.... is often estimated to be the most-played song in the history of radio."

Any sources for this? I was under the impression that, worldwide, 'Yesterday' by the Beatles was easily the most played. TheMadBaron 04:39, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

• 1) Well, for one thing this song is mainly played on "Album-oriented rock" stations, there are a lot of county, classical, pop, stations out there. I would think that Frank Sinatra, the Beattles, Elvis, etc., would be right in there. World wide, I would guess a classical or opeara piece would be in there also. Mozart, Beethoven, Bach, around the world, what about "Moonlight Sonata"? And what do they play in China and India? Now what about the 50's stations? They seem to play the same songs day-after-day, week-after-week, month-after....well you get the idea.

• 2) Now, back to "Album-oriented rock" stations. I would say this was probably true from 1975 -to- 1990. But after that, I would have to think that the Rolling Stones, The Police and U2 would be in the race. What about: Eric Clapton - Layla

• 3) U2 gets airplay on more "Modern rock" stations in major markets, something Zeppelin rarely does.

• 4) According to Classic Bands:

1. The Righteous Brothers - You've Lost That Lovin' Feelin'
2. The Association - Never My Love
3. The Beatles - Yesterday
4. Ben E. King - Stand By Me
5. Otis Redding - Dock Of The Bay

Stairway does NOT make their top 100..!

• Short answer....NO. WikiDon 08:15, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

Thanks, Don. Comment removed, accordingly. TheMadBaron 19:46, 4 September 2005 (UTC)

• • BMI's Top Ten [5]:

• 1 You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
• 2 Never My Love
• 3 Yesterday
• 4 Stand By Me
• 5 Can't Take My Eyes Off of You
• 6 (Sittin' on) The Dock of the Bay
• 7 Mrs Robinson
• 8 Baby, I Need Your Loving
• 9 Rhythm of the Rain
• 10 Georgia On My Mind

• • "Album-oriented rock" - how about some of this selections:

(some of these are more playable than Stairway, lenght and style)

• 1. Born to Be Wild -
• 2. Evil Ways -
• 3. American Woman -
• 4. All Right Now -
• 5. Locomotive Breath -
• 6. Walk Away -
• 7. Maggie May -
• 8. I'd Love to Change the World -
• 9. Long Cool Woman (In a Black Dress) -
• 10. Frankenstein -
• 11. Saturday Night'a Alright for Fighting -
• 12. We're an American Band -
• 13. Rocky Mountain Way -
• 14. China Groove -
• 15. Radar Love -
• 16. Sweet Home Alabama -
• 17. You Ain't Seen Nothing Yet -
• 18. Bad Company -
• 19. Hair of the Dog -
• 20. Never Been Any Reason -
• 21. Slow Ride -
• 22. Show Me the Way -
• 23. (Don't Fear) The Reaper -
• 24. Cold as Ice -
• 25. Cat Scratch Fever -
• 26. Just What I Needed -
• 27. Two Tickets to Paradise -
• 28. I Want You to Want Me -
• 29. Hold on Loosely -
• 30. Lunatic Fringe -
• 31. White Wedding, Pt. 1 -
• 32. Rock You Like a Hurricane -
• 33. Here I Go Again -

Intro to Zeppelin

Having watched this site changed, it is indeed appropriate to label Zeppelin as 'one of the most popular and influential bands of all time' without a doubt.

Lord of the Rings in Led Zeppelin

A friend of mine is telling me that Led Zeppelin frequently references Lord of the Rings characters and places. I havent read the books or seen the movies, so i dont know anything about LOTR. Can someone please clarify or disembaru this claim. Gracias por nachos--Gephart 04:52, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Several Zeppelin tracks reference Tolkien books. Take a look here [6] --86.137.54.95 10:52, 28 October 2005 (UTC)

This is correct, Robert Plant was a huge LOTR fan and incorporated stuff from the books into Zep songs. For example in the song Ramble On

"I ain't tellin' no lie. Mine's a tale that can't be told, My freedom I hold dear; How years ago in days of old When magic filled the air, T'was in the darkest depths of Mordor I met a girl so fair, But Gollum, and the evil one crept up And slipped away with her. Her, her....yea. Ain't nothing I can do, no."

"..the darkest depths of Mordor" this was the mountain/thing that houses the 'big bad' of the books - Sauron. Gollum is also from the book, an emaciated Hobbit creature, quite important in the general storyline. Days of old when magic filled the air could also be a reference to the days of LOTR and middle earth, and the "girl so fair" could be a reference to The Ring, but then again we could all be overanalysts and be over-reaching, its all down to interpretation but who cares just listen to the awesome musi.

Also in the Song Misty Mountain Hop. The Misty Mountains are in Wales. They are referred to in J.R.R. Tolkien's The Return Of The King.

    Robert Plant was not referencing Lord of the Rings.  He Said so in an Interview here: [7] Qballony 21:33, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

He actually says in the interview that he didn't intend "Ramble On" to be a Tolkien allegory or anything, just that it was about what was going in his life, but there's no doubt that "Mordor" and "Gollum" are direct lifts from LoTR. Dharmabum420 23:01, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

(Umm he didnt say it wasnt in that interview and if anyone knew J.R. Tolkens works better you may just know where that ZoSo simble came from ;))

There is also a reference in "The Battle of Evermore" (which some people think refers to the battle in which they defend Gondor in LoTR): ... the drums will shake the castle wall, the ring wraiths ride in black... Dharmabum420 23:01, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

Alternatively, He could have just been using Lord of the Rings as Symbology, but not actually talking about Lord of the Rings.

Qballony 23:41, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Links to "Lyrics" Web Pages

i don't know if there's an official wikipedia policy regarding this, but i don't think the led zeppelin (or any band) page should link to "lyrics" sites unless the lyrics are official (or at least verified with an official source cited). thoughts? (by the way, if anyone has the true, robert-plant-written lyrics to "ten years gone" i'd appreciate them) Streamless 16:30, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Need more bands like these gods

Alright it's fact that all the bands in the year 2001+ are just pure S***, MTV NEWS even stated that we need more bands like Audioslave. Which is a supergroup of Soundgarden and Rage Against The Machine. But yeah, we really need more talent in today's music. Like we need a new Nirvana or something, you know? Like remember in the late 80's when everybody was tired of metal? And then out of nowhere Nirvana came out..Yeah, we need something like that..maybe not happen for another 5 years or so...(It's 2005 now)

dude i wish i was alive when led zeppelin was around....and it is very depressing that we have crappy bands who don't know anything about solos or singing.....i would love to meet them...jimmy page robert plant and john paul jones..come find a chick named xochitl in richlands nc!

led zeppelin cover

Hi this is my first wikipedia thing so I hope i do it ok and apologise if I don't. I bought a record from a charity shop called Hard To Beat Rap Mania, a compilation album. It has an interesting old school rap cover version of Whole Lotta Love by somebody called Vicious Rumour Club on it and I wondered if this could be mentioned? The record is copyright 1989 and has caddalogue number STYRL005

It also features a song Def Beat by Beware Affair which samples Heartbreaker, along with some speech from Mission Impossible.

• • This is not relevant enough to be included, since there are upwards of hundreds of bands/artists that have performed covers of Led Zeppelin songs. firenexx 18:52, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

200.77.160.252 07:44, 31 January 2006 (UTC)Has anyone noticed that in the "long" version of Whole Lotta Love, the "orgasm" part is the exact same song as On The Run from Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon?... at the last part (After the Solo, around 4:20) you can even hear the laughter that can be heard several times throughout Dark Side of The Moon (In Speak and On the Run), and the "Airplane" part is also noticeable. Due to release dates, I guess Pink Floyd covered this song. Is this a Pink Floyd's homage to Led Zeppelin biggest hit? or the effects were added later?