Talk:List of Israeli flying aces

Latest comment: 11 years ago by Irondome in topic The crystal ball has now cleared

Mistakes

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Abraham Shalmon only have 14.5 victories [1] and Giora Epstein, according to the IAF site is still the top ace of Israel[2].Ingsoc 09:01, 15 April 2007 (UTC)Reply

almost no single information in cited, and some egyptian pilots mentioned in ACIG.org that should be included, but the article do not include any egyptian pilot.

You are welcome to add sourced info on Egyptian aces. --Daniel J. Leivick (talk) 09:01, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply
That's right, but that does not mean that the article do mention them right now. One last pharaoh (talk) 14:52, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply
From what I can see at ACIG.org no Egyptian pilot has been credited with more than three kills. Are there other sources. --Daniel J. Leivick (talk) 19:17, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

NPOV tag

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perhaps I'm missing something, but what is the NPOV issue here? The article seems to be a starightforward, factual list of pilots and their claimed kills - what POV is being intorduced here? Canadian Monkey (talk) 19:49, 20 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

One last pharaoh says the list is not neutral because it lacks any Egyptian pilots. That may be true, but he will have to produce sources that indicate there are any Egyptian aces. I looked into on ACIG.org and couldn't find any pilots with more than three kills credited to them. --Daniel J. Leivick (talk) 20:21, 20 June 2008 (UTC)Reply
as I wrote in my edit summary, incomplete information is not the same as POV. This is a simple list, with no opinions presented, nor are any of the facts disputed. There's no issue of NPOV here. I'll replace the tag with amore appropriate one. Canadian Monkey (talk) 20:33, 20 June 2008 (UTC)Reply
I agree. --Daniel J. Leivick (talk) 20:39, 20 June 2008 (UTC)Reply

Bot report : Found duplicate references !

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In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :)

  • "p11" :
    • Israeli F-4 Phantom II Aces , Shlomo Aloni, p.31, Osprey Publishing , 2004
    • Israeli F-4 Phantom II Aces , Shlomo Aloni, p.11, Osprey Publishing , 2004

DumZiBoT (talk) 10:15, 12 August 2008 (UTC)Reply


  • 358 aircraft altogether... And not a single Arab ace... This just has to be propaganda... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.208.202.140 (talk) 14:01, 10 December 2010 (UTC)Reply
    • show evidence of arab aces. show evidence of "propoganda" and then start accusing. facts are all that matter. if you have them, show them.

Neutrality

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Being neutral does not mean just listing accurate information. The title says Arab-Israeli war yet we only see Israelis not a single Arab Ace! Were they just sitting ducks or did they fight? Or were the Israeli pilot invincible? I did hear about at least two Arab aces a Syrian and an Egyptian. Mentioning them would have made you neutral.

As has been said before, if you have a reference for an Arab ace, please provide it. --Daniel 00:22, 11 May 2011 (UTC)Reply

14.5?

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How can someone have a .5 something kill?--75.74.107.88 (talk) 11:47, 20 August 2011 (UTC)Reply

Shared aerial kills occur when more than one pilot hits a target and it is not possible to credit a single pilot with the victory. It that case individual pilots are credited with fractional shares of the kill. It's a British and American practice from WWII. Poliocretes (talk) 07:17, 22 August 2011 (UTC)Reply

Proposed move

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The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved. Article titles should generally reflect their contents; if the article content changes then a name change is not inappropriate. DrKiernan (talk) 19:51, 15 November 2012 (UTC)Reply


List of flying aces in Arab–Israeli warsList of Israeli flying aces – to reflect the actual scope of the article, which is a list of Israeli flying aces. Relisted. Jenks24 (talk) 06:25, 4 November 2012 (UTC) Relisted. BDD (talk) 17:32, 17 October 2012 (UTC) --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 07:11, 25 September 2012 (UTC)Reply

opposed - a quick look in the history of this article and in the talk page shows there's an ongoing debate about the veracity of claims regarding Arab aces. Right now they've been removed, but that's not to say they won't be making a comeback. Besides, the nationality of the aces is of lesser importance than the context of their victories, at least in my opinion. Poliocretes (talk) 08:11, 25 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
  • Poliocretes first point, is however, compelling. If reignites old and bizzarely sourced claims and arguments, then I oppose.
    However, specialists of the Egyptian/Syrian air efforts could create their own pages for claimed Arab aces, and the new pages would stand or fall by the strength of their own sources. I think "list of flying aces of Israel/Egypt/Syria" etc is more logical. just having a list based on a series of wars, without regard for individual nationality will turn into an endless wearying struggle against nonsense. Irondome (talk) 21:09, 25 September 2012 (UTC)Reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The crystal ball has now cleared

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Hello, all,

Now that there is a List of Egyptian flying aces and a List of Syrian flying aces, the redirect page for List of flying aces in Arab–Israeli wars is misleading as it points only to List of Israeli flying aces.

Georgejdorner (talk) 18:16, 24 December 2012 (UTC)Reply

Done. Cheers, Λuα (Operibus anteire) 01:33, 3 July 2013 (UTC)Reply
Cool. Looks like the other pages are fairly stable and factual too and a great improvement. Multi-national lists create rivalries and edit warring. Seperating seems to chill things out. Thanks for putting the work in. Cheers! Irondome (talk) 02:01, 3 July 2013 (UTC)Reply