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Talk:List of LGBT sportspeople

Latest comment: 4 years ago by Jsusky in topic Add Modifiers for Obscure and/or Ambiguous Sports
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Ethics question

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Latest comment: 11 years ago4 comments2 people in discussion

Isn't it somewhat unethical to have an encyclopedic entry for a consistently growing "list of gay people" in any form? A page like this defines people by their orientation, rather than accomplished athletes or celebrities who simply happen to have a non-traditional sexual orientation. It comes off as unbiased and homophobic more than anything else; why should anyone feel the need to track sportspeople by this category at all? 50.98.18.29 (talk) 01:19, 5 April 2013 (UTC)Reply

No, it is not. The article is based upon external references. AS this article, we have List of people with hepatitis C, List of HIV-positive people and multiple examples. It is not "unbiased" or "homophobic" in no way. If you believe the page shouldn't exist try WP:AFD, but it will be kept anyway, just read the previous discussion about this at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender sportspeople. Tbhotch.™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions. 19:19, 6 April 2013 (UTC)Reply
That's a terribly offensive example to prove your point. You're literally equating homosexuals to people with infectious diseases of the blood. Justifying a list of gay people by pointing out there are also lists of people with Hep C and HIV? If anything, you just proved MY point. Sickening. 50.98.18.29 (talk) 20:35, 12 April 2013 (UTC)Reply
I didn't try to compare homosexuality with infectious diseases, but if you believe it, it's your opinion. I was just citing other list articles about living and dead people with polemical and private information in it and with an ethical borderline, but if you feel happy, we have List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people, with subpages from A to Z; Lists of bisexual people, from A to Z; List of transgender people and List of male performers in gay porn films. This is not the only article about LGBT-related people in Wikipedia. If this is "sickening", cut the chat and start to act. You are like almost everybody in the world, you complain about things, but you don't do something to fix the problem, just criticise others for not doing so. Nobody is telling you you are wrong, and Articles for Deletion exists for that reason, but before nominating it to deletion consider it was taken to deletion in the past and it was keep because people sexuality still being a taboo topic, especially in sports. As Otto4711 said there: "Given the low numbers of openly LGBT sportspeople and given the attention that it garners when a pro athlete comes out even years after his/her career is over and given the attitude prevalent in every level of sports competition, given the books written on the topic ... and given the existence of international sports festivals for LGBT athletes, the notability of this subject is unquestionable." So again, if you believe this article should not exist, follow the instructions at AFD. Tbhotch.™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions. 02:26, 14 April 2013 (UTC)Reply

Sources

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Citation's Needed

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Latest comment: 17 years ago3 comments3 people in discussion

I added this tag becuase their are currently no sources to be found on the page (the above link on the talk page does not count). As this list could be a target for vandalism and perhaps even the basis for legal action, it is important that each and every name on this list have a citation that explicitly states (as opposed to merely speculates) the sexual orientation of the person named. Indrian 14:31, 23 June 2006 (UTC)Reply

I've removed this since one can view each person's page to find the necessary citations. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:41, 25 January 2007 (UTC)Reply

Glenn Hunter's page doesn't say anything about his sexuality - and it got his sport wrong (football instead of cricket). A list like this has to have citations for each person otherwise it's a magnet for malicious entries. This is why I've sourced the entries. Nick mallory 04:15, 23 May 2007 (UTC)Reply

Bot report : Found duplicate references !

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Latest comment: 16 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

In the last revision I edited, I found duplicate named references, i.e. references sharing the same name, but not having the same content. Please check them, as I am not able to fix them automatically :)

  • "tait" :
    • {{cite web |url=http://www.gaysports.com/page.cfm?Sectionid=44&typeofsite=storydetail&ID=850&storyset=yes |title=Equestrians Carry the Torch for Gay Olympians |first=Dylan |last=Vox |date=2006 |accessdate=2007-05-23}}
    • {{cite web |url=http://www.outsports.com/campus/2007/0221fisher.htm |title=Georgia hockey goalie comes out |first=Cyd |last=Zeigler |date=2007 |accessdate=2007-08-14}}

DumZiBoT (talk) 13:41, 10 August 2008 (UTC)Reply


Vancouver Winter Olympics 2010

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Latest comment: 14 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

92.252.116.11 (talk) 22:45, 16 April 2010 (UTC)Reply

Journalists? Professional wrestlers?

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Latest comment: 11 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

Why are these people included on the list? Writing about sports is not playing a sport. If a professional wrestler had engaged in competitive (e.g., Greco-Roman or freestyle) wrestling at collegiate or higher levels, then that is a sportsperson background. But that would need to be shown and verifiable. 96.229.78.170 (talk) 18:20, 12 August 2013 (UTC)Reply

Flags and nationalities

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Latest comment: 11 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

I edited this page on 2nd November. I added some flags for the sportspeople and suddenly it has disappeared, I was going to add nationalities after this. I added flags because some readers might not know e.g. what a Dutch(wo)man is so that's why I added the flags so that people wouldn't get confused. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SarahTHunter (talk • contribs) 12:54, 4 November 2013 (UTC)Reply

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Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Latest comment: 8 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Latest comment: 7 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Latest comment: 6 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

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Sexual orientation listing for people in same-sex relationships

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Latest comment: 6 years ago5 comments2 people in discussion

Entries have just been added for Julie Chu and Caroline Ouellette as Lesbian, on the basis of a news article saying they are in a relationship with each other. I'm happy to agree that qualifies them for this list, but I'm not sure it means we can declare them lesbian - either or both might be bi. Any thoughts on how to list them? Could just put "In a same-gender relationship" or "Gay/bi"? TSP (talk) 18:24, 5 June 2018 (UTC)Reply

In journalism it's conventional to talk of a relationship between two women as being 'a lesbian relationship'. If a person is in a lesbian relationship that tends to permit the press and the mainstream media to refer to them as a lesbian.Phantomsnake (talk) 03:43, 7 June 2018 (UTC)Reply

Perhaps; but, firstly, I think we have higher standards of verifiability, particularly for living people; and secondly, this isn't describing relationships but people. It's possible Julie Chu is in a 'lesbian relationship'; I can't see any source that says she is a lesbian. TSP (talk) 09:55, 7 June 2018 (UTC)Reply
I've read up on the guidelines (Wikipedia:WikiProject_LGBT_studies/Guidelines) and it seems you are correct as far as biographies of living people are concerned. For dead people the policy is as I've described above but not for those living. With that in mind, my proposal is that we do not include at all those living people for whom we do not have a source of them publicly identifying as LGBT. Those living people for whom a source is not available and we are faced with guesswork or leaving the section blank should not be on the list. Phantomsnake (talk) 20:20, 7 June 2018 (UTC)Reply
Though, that being said, it seems there is a precendent where self-descriptions aren't available:'Where a self description is unavailable, gay or lesbian is preferred to homosexual in articles about living people.' There is also advice (on the style-guides for biographies) that where multiple reliable sources refer to someone as somesuch that label is preferred over their own term (though caution should be shown in this field, IMO). Seeing as their relationship is publicly acknowledged and noteworthy, and they would likely refer to themselves as L, G, or T it would be acceptable to include them on the list.
As to what term they should be referred to in that column, I would avoid use of 'in same-gender relationship' as being presumptive and/or misleading. They are in a same-sex relationship; we cannot know their gender - correct me if I'm wrong. It's also messy practically - were they to split up would that disqualify them from inclusion on the list?, and stylistically - adding a new, extraneous term. I think my position would be: leave blank, or go with the terminology of reliable sources when appropriate. Phantomsnake (talk) 20:51, 7 June 2018 (UTC)Reply

Add Modifiers for Obscure and/or Ambiguous Sports

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Latest comment: 4 years ago1 comment1 person in discussion

This entry/list could be improved with less-ambiguous designations for the sports for which listed persons are known.

These terms...

"American Football", "Baseball", "Basketball", "Hockey"

...without modifiers, denote the "major professional American sports" - the very well-known men's versions.

Some may raise objections that this would exclude collegiate sports. but this raises the consideration that non-professionals are insufficiently accomplished or well-known to be included

(in much the same way that insufficiently accomplished or well-known individuals get a separate entry in Wikipedia)

For example, take Britney Stinson, who is listed "Baseball, American football, rugby" under the sports category. Checking the extremely scant online notice of Stinson, one finds that this does not denote the NFL, nor pro football, nor professional baseball, but women's professional football and the Women's USA Baseball team.

Surely it would be better to list the sports thus:

"Women's USA Baseball, (WPFL, IWFL, WAFL, AWFL, NWFA, etc), (suitably modified Rugby League)"

See this link for a partial list of women's football leagues:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women%27s_American_football#Leagues

Note that the leagues/associations themselves use "Women" in their names.

Note also, that Stinson does not even have a separate Wikipedia entry - no doubt because of the relative difficulty to find sources to support Stinson's sports record - which also suggests Stinson's relative obscurity.

I also suggest that many of Lesbian entries with "Basketball" listed would be better represented as "Basketball (WNBA)".



Jsusky (talk) 22:07, 2 January 2020 (UTC)Reply

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