Talk:List of Oggy and the Cockroaches episodes

Happy endings?

Should that column and categorization be done away with both here and on the Oggy and the Cockroaches Wikia? N. Harmonik (talk) 19:24, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

Hi, I would imagine Wikia has different rules, so I can't speak to that, but I don't personally see the value in having the happy ending category. That sort of content should be evident from the prose that describes the episode, if it is even warranted at all. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 20:36, 27 April 2014 (UTC)

Trivia and original research

The following content has been removed as most of it comprises trivia, original research in the form of speculation, or draws conclusions without that conclusion being explicitly drawn by a reliable secondary source. In most cases there is no real-world context to explain the significance of the note. Further, most of these are excluded by MOS:TV. This sort of content may be appropriate for Wikia, but the standards are higher here. Much of this content I had previously removed in April 2014, but it was reinserted without adequate explanation.

1. (Note: The cockroaches' laughter in this episode is different, as this is the pilot episode) — The fact that the cockroackes laughter in this episode is different does not improve our understanding of the program or its various episodes. The clause "as this is the pilot episode" draws a baseless conclusion that the voices are different because it is a pilot episode. What does that mean? If we're pointing this out as a "goof", see MOS:TV#Things to avoid
2. (Note: the characters' colors appear pale in the scenes of them on the skyscraper) — And? What do we learn about the series by pointing out that the colors are pale? Where is the real-world context to help us understand the relevance? Another goof? See MOS:TV#Things to avoid
3. (Note: the United States Dollar Banknotes appear on the opening screen) — Again, what significance does this have?
4. (Note: this is the first episode to feature the European Euro sign, stating that Oggy has moved to Europe, unlike Seasons 1 and 2 that feature the US dollar sign). — Speculation. A conclusion is being drawn that Oggy has moved, when that may not have been explicitly stated. That's original research. And even if he has moved, what is the significance? Tom and Jerry, Bugs Bunny, Popeye all traveled around the world depending on whatever story the creators wanted to tell.
5. (Note: In the scene where all 3 cockroaches are discussing plans, Joey is in Dee Dee's colors. This color error occurred in episodes "VIP Party" and "Olivia"). — Like most of the other trivia, "goofs" aren't worthy of inclusion. See MOS:TV#Things to avoid.
6. (Note: though seen briefly, this is the first appearance of Bob) [and similar content] — It is not within the scope of this article to maintain running tallies of when various characters first appear. That information is more appropriate for the individual character write-ups. "So-and-so first appeared in episode 22".
7. (Note: The cockroaches only appear in the beginning and end of this episode [and similar content]) — There is no significance. We don't keep tallies on who is absent in episodes, or how many minutes the characters were on screen, etc. This has been discussed several times at WikiProject Television. Only when a cast member is absent, for example when a cast member on Big Bang Theory broke her leg, is such a fact likely to be noteworthy. Cast members and characters are often not present in episodes. Not a big deal.
8. I've removed various other improperly supported notes.

Since consensus already exists for the exclusion of trivia and inconsistencies, contributors should be arguing for their inclusion, which will be difficult if no real-world relevance can be supported. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 21:24, 24 August 2014 (UTC)

I saw episode 271. Reply

Called "A Trip to The North Pole (Featuring Olivia)", which aired on Nicktoons on 25 December 2014 at 11:30am.

Basically, Oggy, Jack and Olivia go to the North Pole, and Jack is told to deliver presesnts with a elf because the cockroaches chained up Santa. Meanwhile, Oggy and Olivia get lost and Oggy gets chased by a monster, which leads them to Santa's grotto with a chained up Santa being tormented by the cockroaches, and Oggy gets 3 flyswatters combined with turbodrive, but the cockroaches get it and beat Oggy up but then Olivia unchaines Santa and Santa rescues Oggy by using magic and then teleports Oggy, Olivia and himself to the sleigh and then Santa gets hugged by the elf. This episode is either 15 or 25 minutes long. Not sure

Jack: When he finally gets down a chimney using a fake Santa costume, some kids see him and hug him, but his costume falls off and the kids beat him up then Santa teleport's him onto the sleigh. — Preceding unsigned comment added by UltraMario64 (talk • contribs) 19:26, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Original Airdate and English Airdate

Are both really necessary? N. Harmonik (talk) 23:02, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi there, I would say no. It's a French series, so French air dates are the relevant ones. A possible exception might be if episodes aired in the UK first, but if that only happened a few times, we could more easily include that information as a note. Regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 23:25, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

"Season 6"

If "season 6" really is just a "season 3" rebroadcast in HD, then it is not a valid separate season. If so, then the "season 6" section should be removed – it can simply be mentioned in prose (either in the 'Season 3' section of this article, or in the 'Broadcast' or 'Production section at Oggy and the Cockroaches, or both) that season 3 was rebroadcast in HD on [X] dates.

I will see if there are any other comments about this, but if there are none, I will be removing the "season 6" section from the article in the near future. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:43, 14 October 2017 (UTC)

Whoops, I didn't really notice that edit. Anyway, they're not Season 3 episodes rebroadcast in HD, they're remastered Season 1-2 episodes. N. Harmonik (talk) 23:54, 14 October 2017 (UTC)

Same issue applies – if it's not "new content", it's not a "new season", and it should not be listed in the table-format here. (It's fine to mention it in prose/text, though...) --IJBall (contribs • talk) 12:59, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

Even if their official website calls it a new season? N. Harmonik (talk) 00:46, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

That's from a primary source, so not sure how to handle this – it may or may not be enough. But this quote – "In seasons 6 and 7, we’ll find a mix of brand new stories and full remake of classic ones from seasons 1 & 2, all produced in 4K." – I find problematic. What does "a mix of brand new stories and full remake of classic ones" mean exactly? Does it mean entirely original episodes combined with basically just remastered old ones? If it does mean that, it means the new original episodes can be covered, but the remastered ones should not. If it means the "new" episodes are a mix of "new scenes" and remastered "old" scenes... Well, then we've got a mess... But the biggest issue is that you generally cannot have "two" separate seasons of a TV show airing simultaneously – it basically stretches the definition of TV "season" beyond all meaning. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 03:31, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Actually, the fifth and six seasons have been released simultaneously. So far, I have not seen a single episode from the sixth one that is not a remaster and there are approximately a dozen as of now. I don't suppose the fact that the season 6 intro is different from previous seasons' intros lends credence to the possibility that it's a, ahem, real season? N. Harmonik (talk) 18:46, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

Again, two "seasons" airing simultaneously is nonsensical – that's not how TV seasons work. If there are a dozen "original episodes", they probably need to be merged into the 'season 5' section. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 15:33, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

How would we go about finding out which episodes belong to which seasons? Reliable sources are hard to come by for this series. N. Harmonik (talk) 21:41, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Two seasons airing together don't normally make much sense but "Season 6" is a reissue or reruns of existing content and calling it a season is misleading marketing at the sources used. Upgraded and remastered, but this is still basically reruns, not new content. I expect the goal of calling it a "season" is for digital media redistribution. As reruns I'd say just drop it from a table of original airings that this article is supposed to be documenting and note what is happening if it can be referenced in the lead and main article. It is interesting what they are doing and should be covered in the articles somewhere. Geraldo Perez (talk) 00:22, 19 October 2017 (UTC)

Revisiting

As it is pretty clear from the episodes table that "seasons 6 & 7" are indeed just "remastered" versions of previously aired episodes, I once again reiterate that those sections/episode tables should simply be removed. If there really are "original" episodes in there (and I don't see one...), those can be listed. But all of the "remastered" episodes need to be removed – this can be mentioned in prose either here, or at the base article, but the remastered episodes should not be listed here. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 19:45, 27 April 2018 (UTC)

Actually, I have located clips from season 7 episodes that I know can't possibly be remasters here and there. Unfortunately, I can't find info such as titles and summaries. N. Harmonik (talk) 04:36, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

If it's simply "new scenes", it doesn't justify a table listing – it would justify a mention in prose (and sourced, of course). If it's actually new segments/episodes, that would. But, again, relisting a bunch of episodes that were just remastered, and given some new/revised titles, doesn't merit an entirely new "season" section/table. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:52, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

@IJBall and N. Harmonik: I know this is an old discussion, sorry, but I tend to agree that the remastered episodes don't seem to warrant unique tables. A simple note after the plot summary of the original cartoon to the effect of Note: This episode was remastered in 2017 and renamed "Le Name". would probably be sufficient. Or, if there might be new episodes released in a certain year as Harmonik notes above, maybe just add those to a new season table. I'm not sure. But all those airdates are virtually impossible to verify, and are probably not academically relevant since "Remastered Episode" sounds like a fancy word for "rerun", which we don't typically care about. We've got tons of crufty content in this list article, and the lack of sourcing has been a problem for a decade. Regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 14:37, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Obviously, I agree with removing the "season 6–7" episodes tables. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 16:44, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

US air date

Could someone please remove the US air dates of Seasons 5 and 6, as well as its row? It's not showing anymore on Nickelodeon. CriticismEdits (talk) 07:48, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Fancruft cleanup

In these edits, I tried to clean up some of the fancruft-y additions that have accumulated over the years. It's not even close to perfect. There are unsourced sections with unsourced air dates, bizarre section heading names, formatting issues, etc. I removed the "premiere" and "finale" stuff, since these are editorial additions that seem to pop up in children's television articles. Cartoons like Oggy are not serialized. They don't have any continuity from episode to episode, and they don't tell a greater story arc. "Premiere" and "finale" tends to suggest that these are special, exciting episodes that kick start and wind down the series. Not likely with an unserialized cartoon, and indicating that the first episode in a season table is the "premiere" is pointless, since we can tell that by looking at it. Same with "finale". "#1: First episode!" Duh. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 14:41, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

Ah, I see that my changes were almost immediately reverted by Eivinas Maziliauskas here. @Eivinas Maziliauskas:, please justify your reversions. Why are you calling the pilot a "secret" episode. Where does that label come from? Where are you getting the dates that you're adding to this article? Cyphoidbomb (talk) 14:44, 6 September 2018 (UTC)

He's calling it a "secret" episode because it's named that here in the official upload. N. Harmonik (talk) 13:43, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the response N. Harmonik I think maybe calling it something a little more academic, like "unaired episode" or "first episode" is probably wiser than using the glib, promotional "secret" label in the YouTube description. There's nothing "secret" about it if we know that it was the first, unaired episode. The remainder of the content as noted in my first comment above is still unaddressed, and I hope that Eivinas Maziliauskas responds to the comments, because the community shouldn't tolerate attempts to take WP:OWNERSHIP of this article. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 01:02, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Dates in table

What's going on in this table?

Extended content

Season Episodes Originally aired First aired Last aired 0 1 1997 December 13, 2016 1997 December 13, 2016 1 78 September 6, 1998 February 11, 2000 2 78 September 4, 2000 December 30, 2006 3 39 November 18, 2007 2017 (DISCOVERY K2 Remastered) December 26, 2008 2017 (DISCOVERY K2 Remastered) 4 74 August 10, 2012 December 12, 2013 Oggy and the Cockroaches: The Movie August 7, 2013 (2013-08-07) 5 76 June 30, 2017 (GULLI) July 1, 2017 (CN ASIA) 2017 6 78 May 16, 2017 (DISCOVERY K2) May 1, 2018 (CN ASIA) 2017 7 63 March 19, 2018 (DISCOVERY K2) June 2, 2018 (CN ASIA) July 28, 2018 (CN ASIA) 2018

What are all these dates for Gulli and CN Asia, and Discovery K2? What actual information is being communicated here? Picking one at random, are we trying to say that Season 7 (which appears to be largely remastered versions of other cartoons) premiered on March 19, 2018 on Discovery K2, then somehow ended on an entirely different network in a different geographical region? Then what's the second date in the Start date column for? June 2, 2018--is this a second premiere? Why are we tracking it? Shouldn't we be either tracking the French dates (it's a French show) or the dates the episodes first aired if they didn't air in France first?

Also, why is S5 becing called "Season 5 Through The Ages"? @Eivinas Maziliauskas: Since you appear to have driven the train on this, can you provide any clarity, please, because this is a mess that doesn't match any established, quality television article that I am aware of. Thank you, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 15:50, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

Here's another:

No. in series	No. in season	Title (French title)	Directed by	Story by	Storyboard by	Original air date
1	1	"Bitter Chocolate (Season 1 Premiere) " "(Chocolat amer)"	Olivier Jean-Marie	Jim Gomez	François Reczulski	September 6, 1998 (1998-09-06) January 5, 2016 (2016-01-05)

There are two dates listed under "Original air date", one is 1998, the other is 2016. Why are there two dates here? There's no label that explains what this second date means. Very confusing. Is this when the remastered episode aired? If so it's unsourced and it's unclear why we'd care about those specifics. Without any context, the dates have zero relevance to someone unfamiliar with the nuances of the show. And again, do we need to be told that the first episode in the list is the first episode? Can we delete "Premiere" / "Finale" labels? What other non-serialized show does this? They don't seem to care at Seinfeld (season 2), a Featured List article. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 16:13, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

According to these edits by Eivinas Maziliauskas, the secondary dates are US air dates. Why are we tracking US air dates for a French series? I'm fairly certain we would only do this if the series aired in the US first, which does not appear to be the case. These dates are at risk of deletion. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 22:37, 9 September 2018 (UTC)

(Disclaimer: arrived from WT:TV) I'm in favour of removing US air dates. Obviously it's notable that the show aired in the US, but listing the US date for every single episode is fancruft. Daß Wölf 02:50, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

Not to mention, as far as I know, impossible to verify. N. Harmonik (talk) 20:00, 13 September 2018 (UTC)

Cleanup

In these edits I made a number of changes based on my notes and irritations above. Since Eivinas Maziliauskas failed to participate in discussion on any of the topics, if s/he reverts these changes without consensus it will be considered disruptive. I've removed US air dates as most are unsourced, and even the ones that are sourced are of questionable use--why do we care about the US airdates of a French series? It didn't air first in the US, which might be a valid reason to care. I've standardised the headings so that they look more consistent. Instead of crap like:

Season 6 (seasons 1 and 2 remastered) (2017–2018)

I changed it to

Season 6 (2017–2018): Seasons 1 and 2 remastered

The reason is that most of the other headings take the Season + year range format. I've capitalised the headings based on MOS:HEAD and I've changed the language of weird headings like "Unused episodes" to "Unaired episode", because the episode has been used--it's on YouTube. I've also gotten rid of the premiere/finale crap since Eivinas failed to comment on it, and I find it nauseatingly didactic. Unserialised cartoons are designed to be aired whenever and the notion of "premiere" and "finale", which typically connote some grand event, are relatively meaningless. Cyphoidbomb (talk) 23:38, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 October 2018

94.39.243.225 (talk) 08:58, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Kpgjhpjm 09:03, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

US airdates part 2

@SonicClub: Hi there, re: this edit, while your efforts are appreciated, I'm unclear on why you included US airdates for this series, as it is neither a US series, nor did it appear to air in the US before it aired in its nation of origin. What MOS:TV guideline were you going by when you added these? Thanks and regards, Cyphoidbomb (talk) 02:03, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 December 2020

174.94.103.94 (talk) 18:25, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Pupsterlove02 talk • contribs 18:50, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 August 2022

112.197.185.46 (talk) 07:47, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. --*Fehufangą (✉ Talk · ✎ Contribs) 08:23, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 August 2022

69.255.225.138 (talk) 18:34, 25 August 2022 (UTC)

Can you please unlock the page early? I didn't vandalize this page. I wanted to edit to reorganize the credits. Not to mention Olivier Jean-Marie directed every episode until its last season so can you also remove all directed by credits until season 6? Season 7 is when some episodes were directed by other animators.

 Not done: requests for decreases to the page protection level should be directed to the protecting admin or to Wikipedia:Requests for page protection if the protecting admin is not active or has declined the request. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 21:07, 25 August 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 3 May 2024

{{List of Oggy and the Cockroaches episodes}}

2A02:586:A500:3FE8:A887:1A75:9E9:E8DB (talk) 13:32, 3 May 2024 (UTC)