Talk:List of fossil primates of South America

Latest comment: 2 years ago by UtherSRG in topic Taxonomy


Taxonomy

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Looks like the table is outdated with the current platyrrhine family structure. I plan to update it to fit with the current understanding of the families, even if that is a change from how Fossilworks lists things. - UtherSRG (talk) 23:27, 11 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

As Mr.Fink said on talk:Insulacebus, "Fossilworks is a garbage scow, not a buffet". So the table here is full of outdated or just incorrect taxonomies. I was going to start from the top and examine each line, correcting as I go, but that very quickly became problematic. So instead, I'm going to outline the taxonomy as presented in the table here, as best I can, then add comments on what changes to make, probably post a revised taxonomy that aligns with the family/genus/species articles, then finally update the table. Wish me luck! :) - UtherSRG (talk) 11:29, 12 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

Current table taxonomy

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References

Thoughts

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We should update so that the table reflects what is in the articles, but we should also update the articles that are out of date. Rosenberger 2002 is also outdated, but it is more recent than some of the current table data. Where nothing better is known, we should at least update to Rosenberger. I'll let this all sit here a bit, and may ping on some of the editors of these articles. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:05, 12 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

Actually, it looks like Silvestro et al., 2017 Table S4 and Figure S7 have the most up to date listing, although we'd still need to massage their three family system (Cebidae, Atelidae, Pitheciidae) into our five family system (add Aotidae and Callitrichidae) - but that's trivial. We can chuck out Rosenberger.

Data from S4 (with Silvestro -> Wikipedia familes/subfamilies/etc):

  • Incertae sedis: Branisella, Canaanimico, Chilecebus, Lagonimico, Mohanamico, Szalatavus, Perupithecus
  • Atelidae/Alouattinae: Cartelles, Paralouatta, Solimoea, Stirtonia
  • Atelidae/Atelinae: Caipora
  • Cebidae/Cebinae: Acrecebus (stem Cebus), Dolichocebus, Killikaike, Saimiri (or Laventiana) annectens & Saimiri (or Neosaimiri) fieldsi (both stem Saimiri, so move to Saimirinae), Panamacebus & Patasola listed after Saimiri so also move to Saimirinae?
  • Cebidae/Callitrichinae -> Callitrichidae: Micodon
  • Pitheciidae/Aotinae -> Aotidae: Aotus, Tremacebus
  • Pitheciidae/Homunculinae -> Pitheciidae/Pitheciinae/?Homunculini: Carlocebus, Homunculus, Miocallicebus
  • Pitheciidae/Pitheciinae: Mazzonicebus, Soriacebus, Proteropithecia, Cebupithecia, Nuciruptor
  • Pitheciidae: Antillothrix, Xenothrix, Insulacebus

Data from S7 (with Wikipedia taxonomy only):

  • Incertae sedis: Branisella, Canaanimico, Lagonimico, Szalatavus, Perupithecus
  • Atelidae/Alouattinae: Cartelles, Paralouatta, Stirtonia
  • Atelidae/Atelinae: Caipora, Solimoea
  • Atelidae: Chilecebus, Mohanamico
  • Aotidae: Aotus, Tremacebus
  • Callitrichidae: Micodon
  • Cebidae/Cebinae: Acrecebus, Killikaike
  • Cebidae/Saimirinae: Laventiana, Neosaimiri, Patasola, Dolichocebus
  • Cebidae: Panamacebus
  • Pitheciidae/Pitheciinae: Proteropithecia, Cebupithecia, Soriacebus, Nuciruptor, Mazzonicebus
  • Pitheciidae (sister to Pitheciinae, or include in Pitheciinae?): Insulacebus, Xenothrix, Antillothrix
  • Pitheciidae/Callicebinae: Miocallicebus (nestled within Callicebus), Carlocebus, Homunculus

However, S7 shows some potential changes to our understandings of the relationships of the NWM familes, with the following family relationships: (Pitheciidae, (Atelidae, (Cebidae, (Callitrichidae, Aotidae))))

Of the "incertae sedis"" taxa, we can see this:

  • Branisella is sister to the non-Pitheciidae side of the tree.
  • The other four genera have this relationship: (Perupithecus, (Szalatavus, (Lagonimico, (Canaanmico, NWM tree above))))

Whew! That was a lot to summarize. Yay me! :D - UtherSRG (talk) 16:36, 12 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

Proposed changes

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Here are my proposed changes, both to this article and to the individual articles. I propose this with caution as it is based only on my read of Silvestro et al., 2017[1] above. I welcome input, critiques, and support, and will put notes on the talk pages of all the articles I propose touching.

I haven't decided on the Saimiri sp changes, nor the Xenothrix clade changes. I'll wait on suggestions for those. - UtherSRG (talk) 19:36, 12 September 2022 (UTC)Reply

References

  1. ^ Silvestro, Daniele; Tejedor, Marcelo F.; Serrano Serrano, Martha L.; Loiseau, Oriane; Rossier, Victor; Rolland, Jonathan; Zizka, Alexander; Antonelli, Alexandre; Salamin, Nicolas (2017). "Evolutionary history of New World monkeys revealed by molecular and fossil data" (PDF). BioRxiv: 1–32. Retrieved 2017-09-24.

Done?

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Ok, I think I've updated everything. I left the Saimiri species in that genus. In the listing, I put the Xenotrichini genera at Pitheciinae, but put the tribe in that subfamily for the taxoboxes. I'm sure there is some cleanup to be done, but maybe I got it all? - UtherSRG (talk) 14:23, 15 September 2022 (UTC)Reply