Talk:List of hospital ships sunk in World War I

HMHS China

qaranc lists this ship as being sunk [1] but other sites like this forum [2] seem to indicate that she hit a mine killing four people but did not sink. -- Esemono (talk) 00:19, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Braemar Castle

Two days after Britannica was hit Braemar Castle hit a mine in the same field but did not sink. Sold for scrap in 1924[3] -- Esemono (talk) 01:48, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Drina

Appears to have been a Hospital Ship at one time but was serving as a meat carrier when it was sunk [4]-- Esemono (talk) 01:48, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

HMHS Goorkha

Hit a mine near Malta but made it to port[5] -- Esemono (talk) 01:48, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

HS Asturias

HS Asturias 21/3/1917: no patients on board 12 RAMC oderlies, 1 nurse, 1 docter died. As noted the ship was able to beach at Salcombe.[6]

HS Donegal

HS Donegal 17/4/1917 was carrying wounded and was sunk by the U-boat was UC-21, under Oberleutnant Von Zerboni di Sposetti but was not marked as a hospital ship [7] -- Esemono (talk) 03:00, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

HS Guildford Castle

HS Guildford Castle torpedoed 10/3/1918: I have no figures, but it did reach port, ? all survived. Damage seems to have been minor.[8]

Article four

Earlier version had the restrictions spelled out in the intro but I felt the bullet list didn't fit aesthetically and if readers want to know what they are they can click on the wikilink. -- Esemono (talk) 23:31, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

Article four of the Hague Convention X outlined the restrictions are for a hospital ship:

• Ship must be clearly marked and lighted as a hospital ship
• The ship should give medical assistance to wounded personal of all nationalities
• The ship must not be used for any military purpose
• Ships must not interfere or hamper enemy combatant vessels
• Belligerents as designated by the Hague Convention can search any hospital ship to investigate violations of the above restrictions

If any of the above restrictions were violated the ship was determined to be an enemy combatant and could be sunk.

I think that you should add this information into the article. Sure, a reader can click the link to get to it, and normally that is enough, but the Hague Convention's guidelines here are/were of great importance to the subject of this article. Cheers, —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 15:01, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

HMHS Gloucester Castle

For example was HMAS Kuttabul sunk during the attack on Sydney Harbour?

On the 30th of March 1917 whilst in full hospital livery she was torpedoed by U.B.-32 when en route Le Havre to Southampton carrying 399 wounded. Three died during the transfer of survivors to attendant trawlers and it took a further two weeks to tow her to port for repairs. She returned to her owners on the 9th of April 1919 for service on the intermediate routes and later served on the round Africa service earning the nickname Go Slowster Castle because of her inadequate speed.

— [9]

This seems to say that she wasn't sunk... —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 03:41, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Yeah Gloucester Castle is a tricky one, she didn't go all the way under the water but judging by the pictures most of her did. So the question is what is, "sunk" 50%, 90%? If a ship sinks but the water is too shallow and parts of the ship are above water does that mean it's sunk? -- Esemono (talk) 05:43, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

• 
• 
• 

Wow, this just got interesting. It's the same question for whether USS Nevada (BB-36) was 'sunk' or grounded. I'd say the latter, and I think that it may be the same result here? What do you think? —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 04:14, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Based on the pictures I stand on the, "it sunk" side but I can't find out any more info on the exact details of how they salvaged the ship. i.e. Did it go completely under and they raised it? was it grounded during the picture?-- Esemono (talk) 11:29, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

This article covers Salta and Castle, by the way. —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 00:21, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

What does it say about the sinking? I can't get past the subscription screen -- Esemono (talk) 03:35, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

That's one of their free articles; sign up and you should be able to access it for free. (At least, that's what I did a few months ago and I can read all of the pre-1923 NYT's...) —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 03:38, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Well from that article I would say that it totally sunk. -- Esemono (talk) 03:47, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

So would I (torpedoed in midchannel, etc.), but it's interesting that it doesn't specifically mention that. Ah well, it was as good as sunk if nothing else. —Ed (Talk • Contribs) 03:50, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

I disagree. Clearly damaged, but not 'sunk'. HMS Belfast was badly damaged by a mine, but did not sink, she remained afloat and was returned to port. Gloucester Castle also did not sink, remained afloat, and was towed back to port. What percentage of the ship must be below water to count as sunk? Gibson and Prendergast's 'The German Submarine War 1914-1918' describes the first incident that befell Glenart Castle thus: 'the vessel herself was brought into Southampton before she foundered'. i.e. before she sank. I notice that this first incident does not count as Glenart Castle being sunk, though the same thing happening to Gloucester does. The book goes on to say Gloucester Castle 'was also towed in and repaired'. If a ship loses all buoyancy and settles to the sea/river bed, then it is fair to say that she has sunk. If she remains afloat in whatever form, she is not a sunken vessel, and qualifiers such as 'half-sunken', or 'semi-submerged' are more appropriate. Benea (talk) 15:17, 29 August 2009 (UTC)

If it's any help, the Uboatnet entry [10] just claims damage. I notice also the Nevada entry uses the term "beached", which usually denotes a ship brought into the shallows so it doesn't sink any further; is that what they did here? Xyl 54 (talk) 03:14, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

A possibly stupid question

Were there any Gernman hospital ships? The list is just Allied ones - were there no German ones? If there were, surely they should be included here, or the list should be renamned List of Allied hospital ships sunk in World War I? If there weren't, can you put a note to that effect in the text to make it clear to people like me? Thanks. 81.157.195.129 (talk) 08:12, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

Germany had hospital ships but as they didn't need to transfer their wounded to the UK or other islands they weren't often targets. Although the German HS Ophelia was seized by British Naval forces who thought it was on a spy run. -- Esemono (talk) 13:31, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

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SS India

I've boldly deleted the entry for the so-called "Greek hospital ship India" I haven't found any source that says this ship is anything other than a bog-standard freighter carrying coal from Cardiff to Spain: [11], [12], [13], [14]. It's an unfortunate error in photo labelling (maybe in the german original), which I have raised with the IWM. Davidships (talk) 04:25, 27 January 2023 (UTC)