Talk:Wild Card Series

Re: Speedy Deletion

Re: Speedy Deletion, this is an entire playoff round conducted between 8 Major League Baseball teams each year. As such, it is as important as the following pages, each of which eliminates a team from World Series contention:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_League_Championship_Series

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_League_Division_Series

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_League_Championship_Series

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_League_Division_Series

And more important and notable than the 'One Game Playoff', which is only used rarely:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-game_playoff

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Dreslough (talk • contribs) 11:52, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

Name

I don't have any sources that state that this round is called the Wild Card Showdown. Six Sided Pun Vows (talk | contribs | former account) 18:55, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

I also couldn't find a reference to this name. The link given by [1] doesn't use the phrase. 24.189.25.107 (talk) 00:42, 18 July 2012 (UTC)

What is Wildcard?

This page does not explain what a wildcard team is, or how they are chosen. e.g. Can both wildcard teams come from the same division? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.25.29.167 (talk) 15:58, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

Requested Name Change

All media about the 2012 Wild Card Game refers to it as such, not the "Wild Card Playoff". This can be seen on MLB's official website here. http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/schedule/ps.jsp?y=12 ..... I propose that this article be renamed to Wild Card Game, as other articles about the baseball postseason don't use MLB in the title, (Division Series, League Championship Series, World Series). I also think it would be wise to create separate articles about the NL and AL Wild Card Games, as the LDS and LCS have. This would follow suit with other Wikipedia articles, and would fall in line with the official media. --Rekameohs (talk) 10:07, 6 October 2012 (UTC)

1999 Mets/Reds Playoff

I was wondering if the line showing the 1999 actual Wild Card playoff game should be altered to reflect the Mets as the Visitor team and the Reds as the Host team, seeing as this was actually the case (per http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/CIN/CIN199910040.shtml). Thanks. --Ds093 (talk) 10:34, 15 October 2012 (UTC)

"What if" scenario

A list of teams that would have qualified for a second wild card in previous seasons has been re-added to this article. Generally, as there are many "what if" scenarios that could be discussed, the bar for including this type of information is pretty high, and I do not believe this list is sufficiently notable for inclusion on this article: the explanation of the two wild cards is sufficiently clear, with real-world examples now from 2012, that having a long list of possibilities from previous years is not necessary. (Note that the teams would have used different strategies had there been a second wild card, as they did in 2012, and so there is no guarantee that the standings would have ended up in the same way.) I propose reverting this edit. isaacl (talk) 03:42, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

For events which never occurred, it serves no purpose to devote space on WP to speculation (see WP:Crystal ball and WP:No original research). Furthermore, the edit attempts to establish an indisputable fact, which is far from the case. Every MLB season has an article detailing the season standings; if a reader wants to go and look up records and try to piece together which team may or may not have qualified, they're certainly more than welcome to do that. We're not going to start going around to articles about managers, players, and teams that played during a time when the playoff teams were only the pennant winners, adding things like "this manager may not have been fired following the season if today's playoff format was used" or "this team, while failing to win the AL/NL, had a better record in Sept. and would have made the playoffs using today's format, and thus, it is conceivable to think they would have beaten XX team, who only had a XX-XX record in the season's final month." Zepppep (talk) 05:57, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

In agreement with Zepppep. Such speculations would have no end to them. Shall we add a 'what if' paragraph to the Lou Gehrig article, concerning how many games his playing streak might've went, if he'd remained healthy & lived a full life? GoodDay (talk) 10:03, 21 October 2012 (UTC)

How exactly is putting the actual two best non-divisional teams (most people likely don't know who were the runner ups in the Wild Card prior to 2012 and clearly only pertains to the 1995 onward era) in a one-game playoff prior to the implementation of the MLB Wild Card Game a true "what if" scenario!? You really seem to be thinking way beyond or ahead of another wise basic scenario (like thinking about how differently a manager would operate and what not). A what if scenario would be which team would have a better chance of winning, thus altering the playoff outlook (and possibly even further than that). Another actual what if scenario would be speculating how the cancelled 1994 season would've ended if it weren't for the strike. And using Lou Gerhig as an analogy doesn't make sense because that has nothing to due w/ using a final statistic (we can at that rate, go on all day about how much differently a player's career might have turned out had they not gotten injured), like end of season records as a main point of reference. BornonJune8 (talk) 07:02 p.m., 22 October 2012 (UTC)

What ifs are irrelevent. GoodDay (talk) 02:21, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

With the greater importance of finishing first in the division this season, teams managed their resources differently. In past years, when a division leader was assured of a wild card spot, it would start resting its regular players and get its rotation in order for the playoffs, as the team did not care if it finished first or second. Thus it is quite probable that many of the division standings would have been different with the current wild card rule in effect. However, this is a digression from the key point: the list of things that could have happened, if the rules were slightly different, but didn't is very long, and so only exceptional cases are sufficiently notable for inclusion in a Wikipedia article. The general opinion so far is that this information is not sufficiently notable. However, if any reasons for the importance of this information can be advanced, they can certainly be examined. isaacl (talk) 02:25, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

It would be news to me if the speculation being discussed was found in any sort of encyclopedia, or a reference like Baseball-Reference.com or MLB.com. Zepppep (talk) 08:35, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

What if MLB had a playoff format like the NBA and NHL and allowed 16 teams in? What if MLB never expanded the playoff format past four teams? What if MLB never expanded past two teams? What ifs are well and fine in bar room and internet forum discussions. What ifs have no place whatosever in an encyclopedia. We cover what did happen. We don't cover what hypothetically may have happened if we pretended the rules were not what they were. Resolute 14:31, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

Case and punctuation

In some styles, the compound "wild card" is capitalized to keep it together as a unit (you wouldn't want people thinking your card game is wild); in others, it is hyphenated; in still others, it's just left lowercase open, under the assumption that the readership is so familiar with the that the ambiguity will not be a problem. MLB typically uses capitalization of "Wild Card", but not of "game" or "team" that comes after. Many other sources use the hyphen. WP style is to avoid unnecessary capitalization, reserving it for proper names, and to use hyphens to clarify grammatical structure; see MOS:CAPS and MOS:HYPHEN. So I fixed it. Someone reverted, claiming "Wild Card Game" so capitalized is an "official name", which seems unlikely, but is seldom styled that way even by MLB, so I fixed it back. Note what's done in sources; [1].

This is not like Division Series and such, which are trademarks, according to MLB web pages that state "The following are trademarks or service marks of Major League Baseball entities and may be used only with permission of Major League Baseball Properties, Inc. or the relevant Major League Baseball entity: Major League, Major League Baseball, MLB, the silhouetted batter logo, World Series, National League, American League, Division Series, League Championship Series, All-Star Game, and the names, nicknames, logos, uniform designs, color combinations, and slogans designating the Major League Baseball clubs and entities, and their respective mascots, events and exhibitions." Dicklyon (talk) 16:36, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

I can understand if "game" is not capitalized, but in the MLB sources I've seen seen here, Wild Card is, and it genearally isn't hyphenated either. BilCat (talk) 18:26, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

It's not always capitalized even in MLB sources (e.g. footnote here), and per WP:SSF the fact that specialists omit hyphens in their familiar terms is not nearly as important as the fact that sources written to be understood by a general audience punctuate it more carefully for clarity; like the first cited reference; and these MLB-independent cited sources: [2], [3]. These are reliable sources that happen to have a house style similar to ours, and provide adequate justification that our style is not a problem with respect to normal usage. Dicklyon (talk) 19:13, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

As for "genearally isn't hyphenated", that's true. The compound noun is not hyphenated except when used as an adjective, as before game or team. Dicklyon (talk) 19:35, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

2014 update: MLB usage almost always initial-capitalizes "Wild Card Game" (Google search). It's also consistent with MLB and WP usage in articles World Series, American League Championship Series, American League Division Series, etc. MLB seems to never use "wild-card" with a hyphen and neither does WP in most articles. So propose rename to "Major League Baseball Wild Card Game". Facts707 (talk) 18:12, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

Whatever eventually got decided here, the capitalization is all over the place. In most instances here it's "Wild Card Game" but there are one or two that just use lower case. Then there's "Wild Card Series" and "Wild Card Round" which are not always consistent either (at the time of this writing). Finally, whenever a wild card team is referenced, it's that way ("wild card team") instead of "Wild Card Team." Whatever arguments are made in favor of capitalization for "Wild Card Game" would surely apply to "Wild Card Team" as well. Just try doing a search on the article page for "card" and you'll see how it's all over the place.2600:1702:4380:5FA0:C86F:2E29:8A96:4E8D (talk) 05:19, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

Requested move 18 October 2014

Major League Baseball wild-card game → Major League Baseball Wild Card Game – Please see 2014 update directly above. Thanks for considering. --Relisted. Dekimasuよ! 03:54, 26 October 2014 (UTC) Facts707 (talk) 18:21, 18 October 2014 (UTC)

• Not done at this time. The proposal relies only upon "official" naming of the game, rather than common use. Please feel free to reinitiate a move discussion if there are further reasons to consider a move based on Wikipedia policies and guidelines for article naming. Dekimasuよ! 19:34, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

RFC on related page

Hi. You are invited to comment on this RFC. Thanks, --BlueMoonlet (t/c) 18:10, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

capitalization

do y'all think on the MLB teams Wild card berths should be capitalized? Wild Card berths instead of Wild card berths? capital C? — Preceding unsigned comment added by The Speller (talk • contribs) 21:42, 3 October 2018 (UTC)

Major League Baseball postseason results

As I mentioned in the talk page for the Major League Baseball postseason, consolidating most of the postseason articles ought to be done for simplification purposes. This includes the consolidation of the postseason results on this page, the ALDS page, and the NLDS page into one article, similar to NFL playoff results. –Piranha249 21:21, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

I'm not clear on what exactly is being proposed. In the NFL example, AFC Championship Game and NFC Championship Game (the NFL equivalents of NLCS and ALCS) still exist as articles in their own right. --Jameboy (talk) 18:44, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Jameboy: What I propose is we keep those pages, but consolidate the Divisional Series pages with this page and create a postseason results list. –Piranha249 (Discuss with me) 20:28, 5 February 2021 (UTC)

Requested move 11 March 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not successful. (non-sysop closure) Naleksuh (talk) 07:49, 17 March 2022 (UTC)

---

Major League Baseball Wild Card Game → ? – With the new collective bargaining agreement in place, it will be a series rather than a game. This is procedural for the most part; the only question is whether the series will be named the Wild Card Round, Wild Card Series, or something else entirely. O.N.R. ^(talk) 09:52, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

Resubstituting template to see if that solves issue. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 14:07, 11 March 2022 (UTC)

• Wait. I'm sure there will be a new name coming given the restructuring of the postseason beginning in 2022, but let's give it some time so that we have some reliable sources to look at. There is also the possibility of leaving this article as-is, and creating a new article for the playoff format used 2022 and beyond. 162 etc. (talk) 16:06, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
• Wait - We don't know what it'll be called yet, which is why I reverted the previous move. And as 162 said, a separate article needs to be discussed, and I'm leaning toward that being the better option. BilCat (talk) 21:31, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
• whats the rush? -- Netoholic @ 21:41, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
• Don't move - Instead, keep this as a historical article. Create a new article called Major League Baseball Wild Card Series, or whatever MLB ends up calling the newly expanded post-season preliminary round. GoodDay (talk) 02:18, 14 March 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Match the article title, with the article content

Come on folks. We've got the Division Series, League Championship Series & World Series. Wouldn't it be kinda obvious that the first round will be called the Wild Card Series? GoodDay (talk) 15:19, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

It's MLB. They don't always do the obvious. However, the issue here is that there are other options on the table, namely splitting the article in two as discussed above, and which you're aware of. Since the previous move was contested, which you're also aware of, it can't just be moved without consequences for the mover, which you may not be aware of. So rather than just post a comment like this one, which you've also posted elsewhere, you need to make a concrete proposal to either move or split the article. The last move request basically closed as wait, so that's probably not going to be successful. So that leaves the split, and I'm unclear on exactly where you stand on that one. I support a split, but it it doesn't need to be done immediately. We can wait awhile for an official name for the series article, so I won't be proposing one now. BilCat (talk) 20:04, 24 March 2022 (UTC)

They're now called Wild Card Series

We've got new pages 2022 American League Wild Card Series & 2022 National League Wild Card Series (and the 2020 ones), as MLB has changed from the Wild Card Game format to the Wild Card Series format. I assumed my (now reverted) page move, reflected this fact. GoodDay (talk) 17:34, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

@Old Naval Rooftops: and @Muboshgu:, would it best to open an RM on this? or would the creation of a new page called Major League Baseball Wild Card Series, be preferred? GoodDay (talk) 17:41, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I attempted an RM a while back, which failed because we didn't have the official name yet (even though it was "obvious" what it would be). Feel free to start one yourself now that we have the name. O.N.R. ^(talk) 18:20, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

That's the problem. In all the years I've been on this project, I've never been able to understand the RM instructions & how to set up an RM. GoodDay (talk) 18:31, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I would support a RM to Wild Card Series, as that current redirects here anyway. The other series are named similarly: League Championship Series, Division Series. Skipple ☎ 19:23, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I also just realized we have Major League Baseball Wild Card and Major League Baseball Wild Card Game. What a mess. I'm not sure the best way to resolve this. I think we may need a boarder discussion of what goes where and how we are organized. Skipple ☎ 19:27, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Okay, I thought about this for more than two minutes and I think that this would make the most amount of sense to me:

1. Merge Major League Baseball Wild Card to Major League Baseball Wild Card Game. Keep it there for posterity.
2. Create Wild Card Series add all information from 2022 onwards there, highlight history and wikilink to Major League Baseball Wild Card Game in the header and in the history section
3. Redirect Major League Baseball Wild Card to Wild Card Series
4. Maintain List of National League Wild Card winners and List of American League Wild Card winners as is.
5. Maintain yearly pages as planned. eg. 2022 American League Wild Card Series

Courtesy ping @GoodDay:. Thoughts?Skipple ☎ 20:30, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I'd rather just merge MLB Wild Card Game into MLB Wild Card, with the shorter title. The separate game was only around for 9 out of ten years (2020 being the exception caused by extenuating circumstances), while wild cards have been a thing since 1994 (though the strike prevented the awarding of the first ones) and a single wild card was around for 18 years before the single-game version was introduced. In other words, merging the entire concept into the article about the game is backwards. I could even be persuaded without much effort that the best-of-3 series should in that article as well, with the MLB Wild Card article being a general overview of the concept and covering all three formats used over the years. oknazevad (talk) 20:52, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Oh yeah, that's a much simpler way of going about it, and I think that would work nicely. My only issue with it would be the inconsistency of the naming of pages:

• Major League Baseball Wild Card
• Division Series
• League Championship Series
• World Series

The Wild Card would be the only playoff series with Major League Baseball in the name.Skipple ☎ 21:11, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

The annual series pages would have the word "series" in their titles. Personally a difference at the top level doesn't bother me. isaacl (talk) 21:15, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

Yeah this is where I was trying to go with Wild Card Series, but both suggestions make sense to me. Skipple ☎ 21:47, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I agree with merging content into Major League Baseball Wild Card and, as per Dmoore5556's suggestion in Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Baseball/Archive 47 § Wild Card Series or Round, certainly no longer Game, having it cover all variants including the multi-game series being introduced this year. I think keeping discussion of the wild card topic in one article best serves the reader, and the resulting article would be a manageable size. isaacl (talk) 21:14, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

A combined page called Major League Baseball Wild Card. It's what I've always wanted :) GoodDay (talk) 21:19, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

I'd strongly oppose that, as it's a nonsensical title. O.N.R. ^(talk) 23:43, 18 August 2022 (UTC)

What do you propose? We can't leave this page at its current name. GoodDay (talk) 01:01, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

If a major sticking point for some is the name Major League Baseball Wild Card, would anyone be opposed to combining the both current pages to Wild Card Series and directing both to that? That satiates my desire to have the title in alignment with the rest of the playoff rounds. Skipple ☎ 14:27, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Acceptable, as we've got League Championship Series & Division Series, for the second & third rounds, of the MLB playoffs. GoodDay (talk) 14:41, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

I don't see anything wrong with Major League Baseball Wild Card (personally I'd capitalize it differently, but that's a separate discussion). I think "Wild Card Series" is too generic. isaacl (talk) 15:20, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

We don't have Major League Baseball Division Series, Major League Baseball League Championship Series or Major League Baseball World Series. Why make the wild card round, different? GoodDay (talk) 16:06, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

That's because the term "Wild Card", however capitalized, is ambiguous. "Major League Baseball Wild Card" is WP:NATDIS. Inconsistency be damned, it's the best title for the article. oknazevad (talk) 19:02, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

I don't think anyone is suggesting Wild Card, rather Wild Card Series. Skipple ☎ 19:49, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

That's a separate discussion regarding whether or not those names are generic and apply broadly to other sports. isaacl (talk) 19:56, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

We do have League Division Series, as well as NLDS and ALDS. Same with League Championship Series with ALCS and NLCS. – Muboshgu (talk) 20:04, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

Well, this is discouraging. The page's current title isn't going to be changed, even though the Wild Card Game is now historic & the Wild Card Series is current. Good luck to 'whoever' opens up an RM on this. GoodDay (talk) 23:11, 19 August 2022 (UTC)

I have created Draft:Major League Baseball Wild Card Series, if we wanted to create a new article that focused on just the series. That could be used as a start. Esolo5002 (talk) 13:00, 21 August 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 2 September 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Consensus to move to the proposed title, which editors noted was both shorter and more reflective of the event's current form. Some editors argued that the article should remain at its current title, and the Wild Card Series be discussed as a separate page; however, other editors argued that there was a continuity between the Wild Card Game and the Wild Card Series that would make such a split unnecessary. A proposal of merging both the Game and the Series into a unified "Major League Baseball Wild Card" article did not receive significant traction. Consequently, neither the split nor the merge proposals were able to break the consensus for the proposed title.

The RM also addressed the question of what capitalization should be used for the title. The principal line of argument here was whether "Wild Card Series" was a proper noun (which would necessitate capitalization) or not (in which case WP:NCCAPS would dictate the use of lowercase). Ngrams evidence was provided, showing a lead for the capitalized form of the title, though there was debate over whether this lead was significant enough to indicate consistent usage of capitalization. This evidence alone didn't suggest a clear consensus for one capitalization or the other; however, advocates of the capitalized form also emphasized that the capitalized title would be WP:CONSISTENT with other baseball events like the World Series and Division Series. Thus, the capitalized title proved to be backed by a broader range of policy. Note, however, that relatively few people discussed the matter of capitalization in the first place, so a follow-up discussion on the preferred capitalization could be helpful to establish a clearer consensus. (non-admin closure) ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 20:31, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

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Major League Baseball Wild Card Game → Wild Card Series – To match with World Series, League Championship Series and Division Series pages GoodDay (talk) 23:22, 30 August 2022 (UTC)

This is a contested technical request (permalink). Steel1943 (talk) 21:27, 2 September 2022 (UTC)

There's a good case to be made for these two to be separate articles. You even seemed to support that idea when this went to RM earlier this year. 162 etc. (talk) 15:39, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

I'd rather this go to RM first, then worry about separating later. GoodDay (talk) 23:15, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose - Better as two separate articles. BilCat (talk) 03:16, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Why can't we worry about that later? Let's fix up the page name first. GoodDay (talk) 15:29, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Page names are superficial problems. We need to have a clear plan first, which I haven't seen here yet. We can always rename later, and probably will anyway. BilCat (talk) 23:17, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Now someone is proposing a merge elsewhere. No overall plan. What a stinkin' mess! BilCat (talk) 23:20, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Please, let this page be renamed & deal with the other matter later. GoodDay (talk) 03:36, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

• As discussed in other threads, I prefer merging content into Major League Baseball Wild Card and having it cover all variants including the multi-game series being introduced this year. I think keeping discussion of the wild card topic in one article best serves the reader, and the resulting article would be a manageable size. isaacl (talk) 04:16, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Why can't we have an agreement to fix this page name first? GoodDay (talk) 15:28, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

If the consensus emerges to split the article, then there would be nothing to fix. The existing article on the game keeps its existing title and a new article for the series would be created. It would be pointless to move the current article to a new title only to create an article at the previous title. Your impatience has you thinking about it backwards.

That said, I concur with isaacl (and have said elsewhere) that it would be better to merge all of it under the single MLB Wild Card article as a one-stop shop for everything about how the concept has evolved, from one wild card team per league, to two playing a single game, to now three wild cards per league with a Wild Card Series. oknazevad (talk) 17:03, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Why do we need "Major League Baseball" or "MLB" included in the page name? We don't include it in "World Series", "League Championship Series" or "Division Series". PS - I hope we won't have to lowercase any of those, going by another editor's argument. GoodDay (talk) 04:36, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

Because they're not ambiguous, whereas "Wild Card" is, so it's preferable to be specific and unambiguous. oknazevad (talk) 04:57, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

This page is intended to cover the round preceding the Division Series, not wild cards as a whole. We have Wild card (sports) for that. O.N.R. ^(talk) 17:11, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

I'll note that Major League Baseball Wild Card also exists, and I've recommended it to be merged. 162 etc. (talk) 20:42, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

• Support Comment We've got World Series, League Championship Series & Division Series. For goodness sake, we can deal with whether or not to split out parts of the page or not, later. GoodDay (talk) 15:25, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

Edited to read "comment", the OP's support is always implied. 162 etc. (talk) 20:40, 3 September 2022 (UTC)

• Support - I've gone both ways on this, but I support the change. Having two separate articles is confusing and the history of the Wild Card Game can be explained in the Wild Card Series since this has grown out of the Wild Card Game. - Nemov (talk) 15:48, 3 September 2022 (UTC)
• Support move. We can worry about the split later. O.N.R. ^(talk) 16:23, 3 September 2022 (UTC)
• Support per previous discussions on the this talk page Skipple ☎ 22:29, 3 September 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose the over-capitalization – Neither Wild Card, nor Wild Card Game, nor Wild Card Series is a proper name. Major League Baseball is. So it could be Major League Baseball wild card game or MLB wild card series or something like that. I also don't understand the "consistency" argument that's asking for parenthetical disambiguation where the other articles don't have that, and where natural disambiguation is readily available. Dicklyon (talk) 03:04, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Lower-casing would suggest a deck of cards. But let's worry about that upper/lower-casing bit, for later. GoodDay (talk) 03:20, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Wild Card Series is, in fact, its proper name. O.N.R. ^(talk) 08:10, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

• Note it was at ... wild-card game (lowercase) from 2013 to 2017, when it was moved to ... Wild Card Game as a technical (non-controversial) request. Several moves around since then, too. Dicklyon (talk) 03:13, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Let's worry about that later & stay on track here. GoodDay (talk) 03:23, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  There's an awful lot of over-capitalization in sports articles, and when it comes to my attention via a Requested Move, that's a good time to fix it lest it we end of with the impression that it's OK due to a move consensus. If we want to do the move, we should do it correctly. For example, World Series is clearly a proper name, American League Division Series and National League Championship Series etc, are probably proper names, but division series and league championship series are clearly not, and neither is wild card series. Dicklyon (talk) 15:50, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  You're welcomed to the discussion at WP:BASEBALL, if you want to make that argument, concerning the MLB. GoodDay (talk) 15:59, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Usually it's good to keep the discussion where it starts, which was here. Dicklyon (talk) 20:35, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  You're the one who brought up the upper/lowercasing, here. Which wasn't a part of this RM. GoodDay (talk) 20:42, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Yes, thanks for noticing. Dicklyon (talk) 01:58, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

  Nice try. GoodDay (talk) 02:17, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose capitalization. These are just descriptive phrases not proper names. This is typical sports fan (or "Sports Fan") habitual over-capitalization of anything to do with sports (WP:Specialized-style fallacy). Support move to shorter name, other than the caps issue.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  21:01, 4 September 2022 (UTC); revised 06:35, 5 September 2022 (UTC) (I didn't quite make sense at first, as I misread the nom.)  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 

  No, these are proper nouns for specific, recurring annual events. Just because something doesn't have a particularly creative name doesn't make it not a proper noun. Also, the move request isn't about capitalization, so your rationale is meaningless drivel. oknazevad (talk) 21:48, 4 September 2022 (UTC)

  Case is an important part of title/move decisions, per WP:NCCAPS. Dicklyon (talk) 01:58, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

  Then that's proposing a different title than the move proposal. That wouldn't be a "support" !vote for the nomination. oknazevad (talk) 02:24, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

• Support Wild Card Series per nom. As for casing, N-grams show that World Series, League Championship Series, and Division Series are the correct forms, so this one would be uppercased as well per consistency. Randy Kryn (talk) 02:12, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

  If you look at n-grams sensibly, you see that's not so. In "the league championship series", caps are only about 2:1, nowhere near "consistent". Most capped uses are with the league names. Similarly with division series. And World Series has a very different profile in ngrams; it's clearly a proper name. Dicklyon (talk) 03:50, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

  Ngrams are unreliable here because of non-baseball usage, or in "division series"' case, references to regular season series between teams from the same division. Even so, when preceded by the word "the" the capitalized forms have been more common for decades, with "the League Championship Series" passing its non-capitalized counterpart in 1972 – only three years after the round was created and fifty years before the present day. O.N.R. ^(talk) 04:42, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

• Support The best way is to move this to "Wild Card Series" and then decide whether or not to split off to "Wild Card Game" for those years. – Muboshgu (talk) 03:55, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

• Comment This is enough of a mess without introducing the complexity of appropriate capitalisation. I can live with the matter of naming, regardless of capitalisation, being dealt with in the first instance by this RM (as some would suggest) subject that a close of this RM acknowledges that capitalisation is a matter that might be subsequently addressed. Cinderella157 (talk) 11:13, 7 September 2022 (UTC)

We can worry about upper/lower casing later, for all four rounds (and former rounds). Worrying about it now, will only fog up the current RM. GoodDay (talk) 00:54, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

• Comment, they should be separate articles as they are really separate events. A draft for a new article already exists here: Draft:Major League Baseball Wild Card SeriesEsolo5002 (talk) 21:32, 7 September 2022 (UTC)

You'd be better off creating Wild Card Game, as a separate page. GoodDay (talk) 00:50, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

I'm confused about how they are separate events. Both decide the wild card position in the playoffs. It's just the format that's different. A single game moving to a 3 game set is hardly a 'separate event'. Skipple ☎ 00:52, 8 September 2022 (UTC)

• Support per nom.

Ortizesp (talk) 14:28, 14 September 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Notice of related RM

An RM has been opened for League Championship Series & Division Series. -- GoodDay (talk) 03:54, 11 September 2022 (UTC)

"Talk:Major League Baseball Wild Card Game or Series" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Talk:Major League Baseball Wild Card Game or Series and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 September 5#Talk:Major League Baseball Wild Card Game or Series until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. O.N.R. ^(talk) 04:44, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

Clarify. Are you recommending that the re-direct be deleted? or just its talkpage. GoodDay (talk) 05:18, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

Both. O.N.R. ^(talk) 05:32, 5 September 2022 (UTC)