Talk:Malankara–Persian ecclesiastical relations

Purpose of article

Is this article about the period when the Indian church was a province of the Church of the East, i.e. from the beginning until the 16th century? If that's the idea (as it seems to be), then I don't think "Malankara–Persia relations" is the best title. Srnec (talk) 17:01, 1 July 2019 (UTC)

No, this article is not limited to that specific time period. It spans the entire relationship between Malankara Church and the Church of the East. Thank you for bringing that up; I have added this explicitly in the introduction so that any future confusion is avoided. In that regard, "Malankara–Persia relations" was the shortest title that I could think of. It precisely captures what this article is about. Anyone who reads the article in its entirety and refers the references given can confirm this. Swordofcherubim (talk) 11:01, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

It is better to merge this article with the article about India-Eccesiastical Province of the Church of the East: India (East Syriac ecclesiastical province)Br Ibrahim john (talk) 07:23, 8 December 2020 (UTC)

It is better to keep these articles separate as both are in different contexts. A lot of historical references in the current article (eg. Persian crosses) are completely outside the purview of India (East Syriac ecclesiastical province). Swordofcherubim (talk) 21:23, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Scope and Title

The scope of this article is limited to the historical relationship between the St. Thomas Christians of Malankara (in India) with the Church of the East. The following subjects are not within the scope of this article:

• Any relationship of any community outside the Malankara Church with the Church of the East
• Any relationship of the Malankara Church with any community other than the Church of the East

As I have clarified in another section on this Talk page, this article spans the entire relationship between Malankara Church and the Church of the East from a historical perspective, and is not limited to a specific time period. Generalizing this as "Indo-Persian" instead of "Malankara-Persian" goes beyond the scope of this article. Let us please stick to the actual scope of this article and keep its title accordingly. Anyone who feels that a broader scope is needed is welcome to create dedicated articles for that.Swordofcherubim (talk) 23:05, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Chaldean Catholic claims

Recent claims have surfaced (primarily from sources affiliated to Syro-Malabar Catholic Church) that the Persian Bishops who arrived in India before 1599 AD were actually sent by the Chaldean Catholic Patriarch. This claim is baseless because the Chaldean Catholic Church originated only in 1552 AD following a schism in the Church of the East. Considering that almost all of the Persian Bishops who visited Malankara did so before the origin of Chaldean Catholic Church, this invalidates the recent claims that the Persian Bishops were sent by the Chaldean Catholic Patriarch. A closer look at this baseless claim reveals the sad desire to establish that even before the infamous Synod of Diamper in 1599, the St. Thomas Christians were under the jurisdiction of the Pope of Rome. An examination of historical facts clearly show otherwise. So I have removed those claims from this article.Swordofcherubim (talk) 05:56, 14 October 2021 (UTC)

Requested move 19 July 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: procedural close. Requester has been blocked as a sockpuppet; no prejudice against renomination by an editor in good standing. (closed by non-admin page mover) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 17:59, 19 July 2022 (UTC)

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Malankara-Persian ecclesiastical relations → Indo-Persian ecclesiastical relations – Notability. Article is covering not just Malankara but some other parts of India too. Logosx127 (talk) 12:33, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

This is a contested technical request (permalink). Kj cheetham (talk) 08:34, 19 July 2022 (UTC)

• Copied from Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests:
  • This article has been moved several times and the current title appears to be the most stable one, so a full discussion is needed. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 19:54, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

  @Extraordinary Writ: Almost all the sources in the article (to particularly note Perczel, István (2018). Daniel King (ed.). Syriac Christianity in India. The Syriac World. Routledge. pp. 653–697. ISBN 9781317482116.) clearly speak about Syriac Christianity/Church of the East in India and most of them do not even mention Malankara. The current term is not notable.Logosx127 (talk) 00:46, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

  You may be right—I'm not familiar with the subject. All I'm saying is when an article has already been moved multiple times, we have to start a requested move discussion instead of just moving it again. See WP:PCM. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 02:49, 16 July 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Requested move revert 14 February 2024

The previous move completely ignored the Talk section "Scope and Title", so I have reverted it. The scope of this article is limited to the historical relationship between the ecclesiastical administrational province (or See) of Malankara belonging to India's St. Thomas Christians with the Church of the East. Any relationship of any community outside the Malankara See, whether inside/outside India, with the Church of the East is beyond the scope. Anyone who wants a broader scope is welcome to create a new article for that. Swordofcherubim (talk) 20:17, 14 February 2024 (UTC)

Merge proposal

I propose merging Malankara-Persian ecclesiastical relations into Church of the East in India. Both articles are fundamentally speaking of the same subject, i.e., the Church of the East Christianity in India. The existence of two separate articles in this common subject is superfluous.Logosx127 (talk) 06:24, 29 September 2024 (UTC)