Talk:Manchán of Mohill

Well of Manchan of Mohill

John O'Donovan (scholar) visited Mohill-Manchain and said "Monahan's"" (or St. Manchan's) Well is still shown there". But where? Did he see it on a map? Is there a holy well in Mohill called after some other Saint, which used to be Manchan's holy well? Nmclough (talk) 20:12, 10 December 2016 (UTC)

Identity of Manchan

Manchan died 538 according to the Annals of Tigernach. Who was he.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as Manchan Leith Mhor in Litany of Saints (Leith Mhor = Leigh in County Tipperary)?

Probable.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as Mawgan (Maucan or Moucan) of Wales named in the Life of St Cadog?

Plausible. The claims Manchan was a Welshman are plausible and this guy would fit.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as Saint Mochta (Mauchteus) who died 534 (Annals of Four Masters), 535 or 537 (Annals of Ulster)?

The circumstantial evidence is curious.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as Maonacan of Athleague?

Possible, no evidence.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as Mawgan (Maucannus) of Wales named in the Life of St David?

Possible if same as Mawgan in Life of St Cadog? Otherwise No because he had a cushy job ("Master of Llancarfan") so why become a missionary?

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as the alleged Manchan the student at Candida Casa?

No, that's Scotland and this student seems confused with next person below anyway.

• Is Manchan of Mohill same person as ('Nennio' or 'Monen') Manchan the Master (fl. 520) , bishop of Candida Casa?

No, that's Scotland and Master/Bishop is a cushy job, so hardly a missionary.

Wildly inappropriate images

User:Nmclough, who wrote almost all this article, has twice reverted my removal of highly inappropriate images from it. Manchán, if he existed at all, was a very early Irish monk active around 500. Nmclough has put in the infobox a (rather nice) miniature of a north-French monk in vestments with a Roman (not a Celtic) tonsure from 1318. He gives this the highly misleading caption "Manchán, a monk". Below the infobox he has added a Russian painting of 1912 showing the 11th century Russian (Kievan) leader Yan Vyshatich, with Orthodox priests and men in armour, meeting a group of Slavic tribesmen dressed more like American Indians than anything else. This is captioned "Christians and Pagans". Both these images and their captions grossly breach the MOS requirements for relevance and accuracy. I removed them with the edit summaries "nice pic, but nearly 1000 years later, & with the wrong tonsure" and "these are in Russia!" respectively. Nmclough has twice reverted my removals, with the edit summaries "Undid revision 763507448 by Johnbod (talk) Reverting vandalism or test edit" first time, and "undid revision 763607262 by Johnbod - Reverting johnbod arbitary destructive edits, no constructive edits. Folow the process first and Discuss: [[Talk:Talk:Manch%C3%A1n_of_Mohill]]". So I am doing that, but given the violence of his responses, without much hope of the matter being settled here. Johnbod (talk)

You adjectives are too strong and personalised. Most patrician followers and missionaries were Britons so Roman dress influence is expected. The nice infobox picture of "A MONK" is appropriate but not ideal. But there is known shortage of public domain images so having ideal pictures hopefully evolves. One person cannot do everything so picture of generic monk (ie manchan, monachus) is appropriate. I accept your point regarding "pagans and christians" so agree it could be deleted, a replacement picturewould be ideal but pool of CC0 pictures are limited. Nmclough (talk) 23:37, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Well that is progress, but the infobox picture should go too, especially given that the caption misleadingly implies that it is intended to represent Manchán. We have better images for early Celtic monks, and a generalized image of a monk should not be in the infobox, where a portrait is expected. I might add that, unusually for the period, the metal shrine gives the article several decent and very relevant images. These should be spread around the article rather more. The caption of the "plague" image is too inventive - what is there to suggest that this is a "monastery" rather than a church, as the image file says? Johnbod (talk) 03:55, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Captions changed as reasonable comment. Early Irish christians were supposedly identified as, or followers of, Roman-Britons missionaries and cultural influences; introducing Celtic themes is probably historically inaccurate. Nmclough (talk) 03:29, 16 February 2017 (UTC)