Talk:Marlborough School, Woodstock

As an ex-pupil (1972-79), may I make three observations to begin with, beside stating how good to see an entry for the school. Thanks to the originator of the article, too. Had the school actually been a grammar school? It was a comprehensive by 1971 at least and my understanding was that it had in fact been a secondary modern. More research needed here. Secondly, the article seems to suggest that recent success has meant that local children no longer attend. How can this be correct when, as a comprehensive, it will select mainly by distance from the school? Or has the school been so enlarged that local children are simply a smaller proportion of total pupils than formerly? (In any case, what's "local"? Bladon, Bletchingdon, Yarnton, Begbroke, Wooton and Glympton certainly provided pupils in the 70's, as well as Woodstock itself). Thirdly, school status. It had been "Church of England" (whether voluntary aided or controlled, I can't recall). Does this not need adding to the history? Exumbra 11:51, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

In what sense can a Church of England school originating in 1939 really be "preceded by the Woodstock Free Grammar" other than simply chronologically? If there is a link please explain it: it would be fascinating history: but if one ceased to be and sometime later the other began is this information relevant? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.66.27.169 (talk) 19:21, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree it's good to see a Wiki page about Marlborough. I was a pupil in the late 70s, early 80s and the school was not academically "hot" and a lot of kids could escape without much in the way of paper qualifications. There was a divide between "town and gown" in the school, with middle class children heading up the 'O' level route into the sixth form or a CFE and "the rest" getting a few CSEs and heading to Tesco's. Maybe it made us all streetwise. I was lazy and don't blame the school for my underachievement there (scraping through with a few 'O' levels and a clutch of CSEs), so I want to urge those who wish to vandalize this entry (and they have) to stop taking their frustrations out on Wikipedia. It's unfair to the teachers who did try hard. If you say the school's rubbish, what will someone think about those who went there ... and this could include your prospective employer! It's a good thing to be factual and informative but let's leave some of the opinions out! Thank you! -- Chartbury (user) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chartbury (talk • contribs) 22:48, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

One thought about the school's GCE "underperformance" in the 70s - 80s is that the O levels I took there were administered by the Associated Examining Board (AEB) which was known to set the toughest standards (after the Scottish), i.e. was the most difficult to pass or at least get good grades in -- so much so that some universities were weighting AEB grades (it was in the news after I left). I moved to London and took both the London and Cambridge boards which were so much easier -- Cambridge was the easiest of all (which is why it was used by public schools -- natch!) I'm not letting the school off the hook here; they should have signed up with the easiest exam board and had us all pass!

New post not connected to previous unsigned paragraph. I am intrigued by the comments about A.G. O'Hagan being "ahead of his time" and forseeing times when technology would mean increased leisure time. Not only are these assertions unsupported in the text but the clear implication of the way this is described in the article is that he encouraged pupils to get the less well thought-of CSE rather than strive for the academically more respected O-levels, and in the face of modern technology he encouraged pupils into hobbies, sport and community service! Was this instead of lessons?!! And can you name a decent school that wouldn't want its pupils achieving at sport, enjoying a hobby and helping in the community?!! I guess this is based on recollection: as someone who took the O-levels and VIth Form route my recollection is of a head who - although a nice enough man - did not celebrate academic achievevement uniformly at all: I don't remember that any of us from the first few years of the VIth were ever congratulated by him on getting to university! That would be unthinkable in any 2ndary school today! (He Hadn't attended university himself, after all). It all felt like he'd have been happier in a uniformly deprived area, helping disadvantaged children aspire and achieve, rather than be in Woodstock which has never been a great industrial centre and - gasp - has a middle class... But then memory can be faulty.

Chartbury. Why do you say middle class children went by the O-level route? Did they tip the teachers before they were entered? Or were they more bright and hard working and had more supportive parents than their working class peers? Or did the school discriminate against working class children? Or were less wealthy families passive victims of O'Hagan's own educational vision consequently heading, as you put it, for Tesco's? Or was it just another age when, without league tables and New Labour's vision for a University educated 50%, schools just got on with what they thought was best, however well that did or did not equip their pupils for life after school? I am intrigued. Exumbra (talk) 21:31, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

Dear Exumbra, It's just a general observation that bothered me at the time. There was no doubt kids with university parents, from more middle class homes etc found themselves cordoned off in the O level section (although they weren't the only ones in it!) Let's face it, kids with books in the home who are taken abroad on holiday to practice their French have an advantage on those who don't and the school, for all it's socialist pretensions, did nothing to shorten the odds for the unluckier born. Comprehensive schools are an Establishment dream; creating an army of peaons in the main, at least back in the late 70s, early 80s when I was there. Having said that, I think that differentiated instruction within secondary schools (as they have in the USA, and as we nearly had with CSEs and GCEs) is the way to go. It needn't be class-based at all though. Chartbury Chartbury (talk) 03:04, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Dear Chartbury, I think I see your point. There is a lot made in these pages of a working class-middle class divide. Was Woodstock so divided and if so any more or less that anywhere else at the time? The English atttitude to education seems so varied, but it's not really the social class of one's parents that matters so much as whether they think education matters. But of course, those who come from a background where education is valued tend to be better educated and therefore tend to have better paid jobs and so tend to be labelled middle class. I was a teacher myself for a time, and succesful learning can indeed happen only when teaching is indeed differentiated to meet the needs of pupils as individuals. Unfortunately, when this was done by institution (grammar & secondary modern) or by exam (CSE and O level) inevitably one of them is seen as the "best". Grammar schools were originally a way for anyone of any social class to make the best of academic ability and so to encopurage social mobility, but are rarely perceived as such nowadays! We become torn between equality of opportunity education and the fact that some of us are in fact highly skilled with our hands but others with their minds and most of us somewhere in between. Altho' this is a great discussion, I'm not familiar enough with Wikipedia to know if it's the right forum for such a thing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exumbra (talk • contribs) 12:29, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

This article is seriously promotional, biased and opinionated

It needs to be stripped down. It reads like a school prospectus and contains some down right untruths.

"Now it is arguably one of the best performing schools in the county, due to excellent reports, newspaper rankings and its proximity to a university."

It's certainly not proximate to Oxford University compared to other schools in the county, many of which are in Oxford. According to the Guardian website only two other schools in the county had worse A-level results in 2008 and one of those was Kingham Hill, which is a specialist school for dyslexics. When have ex-pupils ever been called "Marlboroughites" Why is there a picture of Blenheim palace, to somehow imply the place is a public school?! This is misuse of Wikipedia. Expupilatmarl (talk)

User_talk:86.3.136.164 removed bias tag before dispute resolved. This is against NPOV policy - so tag restored. In general 82.13.161.168 seems to be responsible for a large number of promotional edits to this article. Expupilatmarl (talk) 11:40, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

I agree someone went to great lengths to add poetic license to this entry with photos of Blenheim and Oxford etc and colourful text additions. I wonder if it was a pupil wanting to feel Marlborough is an elite institution and then sending people he/she knew to view the school's Wikipedia entry or perhaps a teacher/head on the lookout for a new job and wanting to impress for similar reasons. Just shows how many Wikipedia entries need to be taken with a barrel of salt: History is writ by those who can be bothered to write it and is in the eye of the beholder ... Hmm, one glorious rewrite of history was added here! (I see some has been removed already!) P.S. Five miles can be called proximity to a university; Woodstock isn't the Outer Hebrides! Oxford professors have/do send their offspring there. Chartbury

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