Talk:Mayapple Press

[Untitled]

Yes, I am the publisher. We've been in business actively since 1992 (and in some sense since the late 1970's), and have published a number of significant poets. SPD carries our books, and we are trying hard to be "notable." I haven't had time to look up citations, but we've certainly had book reviews in Small Press Review and other places. I didn't study the guidelines carefully enough to do the research before I started the article (mea maxima culpa), although I have corrected several articles in the past. Apart from being the publisher, I am the author of several small press books of poetry and an important book of translations - if you care to look, my web page is at www.judithkerman.com. I have not had the brass to put up an article about myself... but my authors deserve the notice.

Judith Kerman

Later that night: I have added references. I refrained from adding every bookstore, online catalog and online list of presses, since that would get tedious for both the readers and myself. These are all news stories about our books and authors. I hope they are a decent start. Anyone interested in seeing who I am, look at my webpage, please: www.judithkerman.com - I've been toiling in the vineyards for many years. Whether I'm "notable" is another question.

The problem is that your article promotes your publishing business. I see little in the way of visibility to your authors. If they are notable then I suggest creating pages for them. If you cannot establish notability of the subject of this article (your business), then it will probably be deleted. §FreeRangeFrog 07:07, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

I see that notability was established and authors have articles of their own. Good! §FreeRangeFrog 17:24, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

We will be happy to create pages for our authors (those who don't already have them) - it didn't occur to me, and glad to do it. Our primary mission is to give deserving authors, especially poets, visibility and to help them reach readers.

Is there anything else I need to do to satisfy concerns about conflict of interest? Although we are not a 503C, I do not receive a salary or take profits - to the contrary, I personally subsidize our activities with both my time and, when necessary, capital. I hope we can work in support of Wikipedia's mission, to make significant information available worldwide.

206.205.184.2 (talk) 00:36, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Request for review of draft

Hello.

I am interested in cleaning up this article to address the issues of verification, COI, and the obsolete links. I have a major revision written that I would like to be reviewed by all interested editors prior to submitting, but I am not sure how to do this. I am interested in collaborating with any other editors who have an interest in this article. Thanks.

Edward Dixon Edward Dixon (talk) 15:01, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

FYI, The version referred to above is at User:Edward Dixon/sandbox/Mayapple Press. DES ^(talk) 16:26, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

The clean up includes:

• “Mayapple publishes poetry, fiction, and creative non-fiction by various notable authors”. Primary source.
• ”A few authors had earned literary awards prior to having books released by Mayapple, including Jeannine Hall Gailey, Brian Aldiss, Howard Schwartz, and Allison Joseph.” It's irrelevant.
• “Many authors’ books from Mayapple have been widely reviewed and several books have been nominated for the Pushcart Prize, Michigan Notable Books, the Griffin Poetry Prize, and other prizes.” Unreferenced
• “Other authors have had their poems selected for Verse Daily” is this notable?
• “Mayapple Press is a member of CLMP (Council of Literary Magazines and Small Presses) and of AWP (Association of Writers & Writing Programs)” Why is this even notable enough to mention?
• “ Books are distributed by Small Press Distribution, Partners Distributing, and are available online at Amazon.com and other major online booksellers.” So?

Not sure any of this is any improvement at all. Theroadislong (talk) 19:32, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your interest and I'd like to work with you on these edits. First of all, the links still need major cleanup. Many of them do not work or do not relate to the point they intended to reference, and at any rate spotlight older authors at the expense of newer ones. That was my primary reason that I wanted those edits. I do believe it is interesting to note differences between authors who come to a press already of some notability (Aldiss, Joseph, Gailey, Schwartz) and those who attain their notability through the Press (Dickey, Winegarden, Kirkpatrick), and that is why I contextualized it as I did. Let's talk about this and come to a consensus.

I'll grant you your point on Verse Daily and the dropping of the last paragraph, no problem. My goal here is to remove the lack of neutrality and the verification issues, as I believe are yours so this article can stand without tags. Let's talk specifically where you think statements are unreferenced and if we can't reference them, I assume we shall have to delete them. Perhaps some of what seems unreferenced now in terms of Pushcarts, Michigan Notables, Griffin, etc can be referenced by selective links from various authors?

I edited the first paragraph rather significantly because it sounds promotional & perhaps even defensive to me and I thought my wording was less so. You may disagree of course. The Press did not seem to begin as a significant operation until 1992, not 1978.

Anyway, can we work together on this? If you want to take the lead and make the changes, I am fine with that. But let's get this article right.

Thanks.

Edward Edward Dixon (talk) 20:50, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Responding to some of the comments of Theroadislong, above:

• “Mayapple publishes poetry, fiction, and creative non-fiction by various notable authors”. Primary source
  • This is exactly the sort of thing foe which a primary source can an should be used, as per WP:PRIMARY. Aside from removing the word notable, which is probably Wikipedia-jargon in this context, or else an uncited opnion, I would leave this exactly as it is. What sort of works and authors a press publishes is a relevant fact about the press, and is properly cited to a primary source unless seriously challenged.

It was the "notable" bit that I thought required something more than a primary source. Theroadislong (talk) 12:12, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

• * ”A few authors had earned literary awards prior to having books released by Mayapple, including Jeannine Hall Gailey, Brian Aldiss, Howard Schwartz, and Allison Joseph.” It's irrelevant.
  • I would say that it is quite relevant, as helping to show the mix of new and established authors that the Press publishes.

OK but it needs sourcing.Theroadislong (talk) 12:12, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

• * “Mayapple Press is a member of CLMP (Council of Literary Magazines and Small Presses) and of AWP (Association of Writers & Writing Programs)” Why is this even notable enough to mention?
  • notability is a concept used in deciding what articles Wikipedia shoudl have. It is specifically not to be used in deciding what content an article about a notable subject should have. I think this content is relevant to the article, althoguh not vital. Membership in associations is some measure of the legitimacy and focus of a firm, and is often included in such articles.

I hope these observartions and views are helpful. DES ^(talk) 12:02, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

OK again but it's all unsourced. Theroadislong (talk) 12:12, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! You guys are great. I have updated the article based on what I understand our consensus to be now. There are two problematic links. If an improved Botkin link can't be found, we could just delete the link. On the Paz link however, if it can't be resolved, we may need to delete the content (as I did in my Sandbox revision) , Now, can we delete the neutrality and notability tages? I had actually thought notability was already resolved for this article when I started to work on it.

Best, Edward Dixon (talk) 16:36, 20 August 2015 (UTC)Edward