Talk:Metal Gear Solid (2000 video game)

Ambiguous Description

The page says the game "is neither a prequel nor a sequel", but then it says it "serves as an alternate sequel". So, is the game a sequel or is it an alternate for Metal Gear Solid on the Playstation? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.110.125.34 (talk) 17:23, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

13th July 2019 Page Move

"Solid" has been mispelt as "Soild" in the title. AnOrdinaryBoy (talk) 02:53, 15 July 2019 (UTC)

Page move.

To be honest, I would prefer if the article was titled Metal Gear: Ghost Babel as well, but I think I would stick to guidelines for formality sakes. Even the Kojima Productions' website list this game as "Metal Gear Solid (GBC version)". There are numerous other gaming franchises where different installment share the same title. Castlevania, Ninja Gaiden, and Bionic Commando all come to mind. Jonny2x4 (talk) 04:11, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Even wiki formalities didn't bar the Yoshi's Universal Gravitation article. This page should be moved. Splïtter (talk) 12:10, 21 April 2014 (UTC)

The Splïtter is being ridiculous

Regardless of canonicity, the events of this game clearly do not take place in the main timeline. Metal Gear Solid makes it clear that Snake met Mei Ling in 2005 and MGS4 makes it clear that Big Boss survived the events of Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake while Ghost Babel shows that Big Boss died in Outer Heaven and never created Zanzibar Land. There should be no debate about its place in the main timeline. The game takes place in an alternate universe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.59.223.143 (talk) 23:25, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

Requested move 4 January 2015

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page not moved. Rider ranger47 ^Talk 15:29, 25 January 2015 (UTC)

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(non-admin closure)

Metal Gear: Ghost Babel → Metal Gear Solid (Game Boy Color) – Restore original title from undiscussed move & rewrite. (The NA or European box art should also be restored, rather than the JP box art.) WP:NCVG is clear: use the "official title in the initial English release", not the Japanese release, barring a good reason. This game is "Metal Gear Solid" in North America & Europe, and the fact a parenthetical disambiguator is needed isn't cause to use the Japanese name instead. SnowFire (talk) 18:27, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

I know this is an unpopular use of WP:COMMONNAME, but could it be argued that "Ghost Babel" is the common name of the game? I'm reluctantly supporting a move, but only because we don't have a clear common name. ONR (talk) 20:14, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

• It could be, yes. I wouldn't be surprised if within the online Metal Gear / gaming fandom, it's known more as Ghost Babel by those who care simply for clarity's sake. (My one exposure to this, via an SA LP, certainly used "Ghost Babel.") However, I'd have to assume that among casual gamers / review sites / etc., it's still better known by the title on the box (if known at all), and that would presumably be a majority of people. I can certainly be convinced to use COMMONNAME especially when an official English language release is obscure and/or irrelevant, but I don't think this game qualifies for that. SnowFire (talk) 21:03, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

• If this is moved we should put the NA Box art back up since it was there before the Japanese one.--67.68.161.176 (talk) 04:01, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

• Actually, we can use either the Western or the Japanese cover art, regardless of title change. --George Ho (talk) 05:07, 16 January 2015 (UTC)

• Actually actually, we should use a Western release of the art regardless of whether the article is moved - see WP:VGBOX / WP:STOPCHANGINGIT. "English language covers are preferred for identification." To be sure there are exceptions, but "match the arbitrary Wikipedia title" is a weak one to use. SnowFire (talk) 18:44, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:NATURAL. Despite regional differences, because natural disambiguation is possible, we should use what the Japanese release has used since the release. I'm sick and tired of using parenthetical disambiguation in many articles. --George Ho (talk) 05:06, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
• Support - per nomination. Also, I know its only anecdotal, but I've never really heard it be referenced as "Ghost Babel" in English sources, so it seems like WP:COMMONNAME may very well apply as well. Sergecross73 msg me 21:33, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
• Comment Some sources using "Ghost Babel" I found with quick Google search: nintendo.co.uk, uk-blog.konami-europe.com, Destructoid, Pelaaja --Mika1h (talk) 00:57, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
• Support - per nomination. There is no way to check whether WP:COMMONNAME applies to either name in non-Japanese circles. MGS fans and game magazines and websites might call it Ghost Babel just to avoid any confusion, it was released as Metal Gear Solid in other territories. I did notice that Game Informer, GameRankings and GameSpot call it Metal Gear Solid. Since Wikipedia is written for a large audience, and not just gamers or people interested in video games, I think WP:NCVG does apply here. And besides, the original Japanese name is mentioned. --Soetermans. T / C 10:58, 23 January 2015 (UTC)
• Oppose - The game is referenced by its original title in the credits for Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty and in the Extra Ops for Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes. I think the game is commonly known as Ghost Babel well enough that it could use the original title on this site. Jonny2x4 (talk) 02:35, 25 January 2015 (UTC)

Oppose I am for keeping the Ghost Babel name. This game is widely known as Ghost Babel and changing it to MGS will make it harder to find it on Wikipedia.Oranjelo100 (talk) 06:10, 25 January 2015 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Comments on above RM

Two opposes in short succession followed by a NAC on the same day before they could be responded to... well, it was a long-in-the-tooth RM.

Anyway, the name in the credits of MGS2 / MGS5 doesn't appear amazingly relevant to me? Perhaps it implies the "official title" via retcon, but eh. For the "game is widely known as Ghost Babel" argument, nobody has actually provided any evidence this is the case, and it's difficult to say because the game isn't well-known in general.

Not going to re-open the RM myself, but figured I'd say my piece regardless. SnowFire (talk) 22:50, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

I agree, SnowFire. The supposedly common name can't be verified. I actually provided a couple of sources that show differently. All the references in the article that actually use Ghost Babel are Japanese. Even if it is indeed called Ghost Babel in two English translations, that still doesn't mean we should call it that too. Besides, from a game developer's point of view, it would make more sense just to call it Ghost Babel, assuming the player knows what is meant and not having to go through calling it "the Metal Gear Solid that came out on the Game Boy Advance." That's just relying on in-universe universe information. But Wikipedia is written for a large audience, not MGS fans or even the general video gamer. The argument that it "wouldn't be easy to find" doesn't hold water because we would redirect it to the correct title (just as Ghost Babel redirects already) and the Japanese name will be put on top in the lead. --Soetermans. T / C 14:53, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

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Special Missions and pre-MGS2 Raiden appearance

It seems like a recent Gamechamp3000 video has prompted some people to note that the postgame unlockable "Special Missions" actually alluding to the player controlling Raiden in that version of the game, rather than Solid Snake. I'm not sure about the stated canonicity of Ghost Babel, but is there any reliable source that backs up the claim? It's already been added to Raiden's page, but without a source. Ithinkiplaygames (talk) 23:02, 30 April 2023 (UTC)

The fact that at the end of VR training, N°4 calls you Jack and there are only 3 people with that name in the entire Metal Gear series, those being Big Boss, Raiden, and Ivan Raidenovitch Raikov. Only Raiden is known to have gone under VR training. Also we could just say that it was his first mention or something instead of appearance 151.67.127.133 (talk) 22:02, 19 February 2024 (UTC)