Talk:Mollie Kyle

Date of pictures

The profile picture is said to be from 1917. In Wiki Commons is another picture of Mollie with her husband, which is placed in the same year. As both pictured women look very different, not only in age, I wonder if the profile pic might show one of her sisters instead of Mollie? Glamourqueen (talk) 12:15, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

• The current photo, File:Mollie Kyle by Raymond Red Corn.png, appears online in the Tulsa World and is credited to the book Killers of the Flower Moon. The book has no date for the photo, but given that the relatives she's pictured with died in the early 1920s and photos pre-1929 are public domain, this photo is likely public domain (although there may be an argument it was first published in 2017 and still copyright protected). I mention this since the current license listed is very likely incorrect. The picture is definitely (according to its original source) Molly, but its original source lacks a date. I have no idea where the 1917 date came from. TulsaPoliticsFan (talk) 17:42, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

  Thank you for taking the time to answer. If this is Mollie I am still confused by how she appears so very different in her features in both pictures. One looks very refined and almost maiden-like, the other more natural and - given the grieve she surely had - untimely aged. Even the bone structure and nose looks different and I can't really put my finger on if this is because of lighting or maybe retouche. I tend to think of books as a reliable source but I also had several historic books which featured wrongly attributed photos, so maybe - if this really is by mistake - it started there. But who knows, maybe it's just my perception of both pictures :-) Glamourqueen (talk) 15:15, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

  So trying to hunt down the second photo, I think the answer is its a bit older than the it says on WikiCommons. File:Ernest Burkhart and his wife Mollie Kyle.jpg is listed on Commons as published 1917, but the source is Grann's book. Grann credits the photo to the Oklahoma Historical Society who have the photo as undated and post 1939 (which cannot be correct since the marriage ended by 1926).

  If I were to guess, the pre-marriage photo is probably older than listed while the post-marriage photo is probably actually newer than listed. TulsaPoliticsFan (talk) 19:10, 20 April 2024 (UTC)

  Amazing research - thank you! But you consider this to be the same woman, right? I am still confused but nevertheless it would be possible. The hard work and life, the grieve and the poisoning together with technical circumstances of taking and retouching pictures are perfectly possible explanations. Glamourqueen (talk) 23:52, 20 April 2024 (UTC)