Talk:Naqshbandi/Archive 1

Archive 1

Expert Arbitration Needed

This article is in a perpetual state of adding new materials and editing in the name of 'purging'. This article has now lost all its authenticity ! None of the parties involved use any reference at all to support their claims. In order to have a better knowledge on this topic, please use other sources ! --Farseemm 01:46, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Somebody is trying to keep a very biased and incomplete history of Naqshbandi silsila. Comments have been made without any reference at all. On the other hand, a well referred version (that on 14 May 2007, 16:28) has been purged as 'vandalism'. Just compare the two versions and see for yourself which one is more complete, well-referred and balanced. I request arbitration.Farseemm 18:55, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

BismillahirRahmanirRahim

Immediately after I made the changes below, Spasage reverted it as "vandalism." I replaced my changes and added the dispute box that the neutrality of this article is now contested. See my comments about the matter from earlier this morning:

Added the Bismillah, the Naksibendi chain, and replaced the link to the Ottoman Dergah in New York. I believe it is important for all perspectives have an opportunity to be represented, and no one has the right to censor or forcibly exclude anyone else. If you disagree with something that is here, this is the page to discuss it. I am objecting to the Mujaddadiya branch which has inserted statements pointing to themselves as the only legitimate lineage, and would like to discuss how to organize this article in a way that is more fair.

husnu, 4/12/06

I just removed a HUGE intrusion of Owaisiah propaganda inserted by the same anon editor who's been doing the same thing to the Sufism page.

If the Owaisiah are noteworthy, they should be in Wikipedia. However, they aren't the only Sufis or the only Naqshbandis. They should not be disproportionately represented. Zora 03:02, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

LONG LIVE OWAISIAH

There is not need to put BismillahirRahmanirRahim at the top of the page. There is no POV issue. If you want to put BismillahirRahmanirRahim please explain why you like to do it? --Spasage 07:37, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

-- The Hakkani lineage has a right to be here if the Owaisiah and Mujaddadiya are too. Please explain why you are removing it. -- The Holy Prophet whom all three lineages list first in their Chain of Transmission was writing "BismillahirRahmanirRahim" at the top of his communications and that is why i like to do it. Yonderboy 09:26, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I understand lineage thing, but what is purpose of "BismillahirRahmanirRahim - In the Name of Allah, Most Merciful, Most Compassionate". --Spasage 09:59, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I guess my feelings on the Bismillah are that wikipedia is NOT a secular encyclopedia but is a place for all voices to speak, and in the writings of muslims we put "BismillahirRahmanirRahim" at the top always. So far as the POV issue, my main reason for putting that there was because of the sweeping revisions removing the Hakkani Chain entirely, but if you are accepting for that part to be here I'm willing to agree that there's no major POV dispute.Yonderboy 03:49, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Can anyone help me find a better source of info on the Tauheedia branch? Should this be changed to "Tawhidiyya" instead? It definitely needs cleanup... --Ganymede23 17:32, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

I have changed the Naqshbandia Owaisiah part in this Naqshbandi article. I came back after some time and somebody has already changed it. The basic conflict is about the leader who is leading Naqshbandi owaisiah branch. My point of view is that true descendant of Maulana Allah Yar khan is Ameer mohammad akram awan. The guy who changed my editing held that the current leader is Baig Sahab, who actually has been expelled from the silsila due to his mutiny with silsila and misleading innocent people. My proves are as under:

1. One self evident prove is that, at the end of the article the reference websites belong and clearly indicates that Silsila is lead by Ameer Muhammad Akram Awan. These are official websites also featuring the picture of Maulana Akram Awan. So, myth about Baig sahab is a self-contradicting hypothesis.

2. There are 300,000 followers who officially belong to Silsila Naqshbandia Owaisiah. It has headquarters all over pakistan, main headquarter located at Minara, Chakwal. On the contrary, how many followers are with Baig Sahab? An outcast with some followers thats it ? There is a monthly journal published by Maula Akram Awan called "Al-murshid". Baig Sahab seems rather inactive about his preaching, with no journals and publications.

3. Most verifiable prove that is more like a self-evident phenomenon is the Online Zikar (Spiritual exercise) session that takes place on Paltalk under the section of Religion>Islam>OurSheikh Room. Any Administrator is more than welcome to visit that room to verify the truth of this claim.

On the basis of these arguments i would like to request that this section should be locked for editing for anonymous users + users who dont assume the burden of proving their editing. I am myself follower of this sect. I would appreciate if administrators could look into that and support my point of view. Thanks Minhaaj 22:31, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup

This page has turned in to a dumping site for the shajaras of all the different Naqshbandi salasil. I'm going to get rid of them all except the shajarah to Bahauddin Naqshbandi (and maybe Ahmed Sirhindi, since he is a major figure in Naqshbandi history). Sub-silsilahs should create separate pages if they want to paste their specific shajarah. --Barastert 23:18, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Sheikh al-Islam of Turkey and Cyprus???

Can whoever posted this article please provide proof that Sheikh Nazim is indeed the 'Sheikh of Islam of Cyprus and Turkey' as Turkey has a head of it's religious board (who is not Sheikh Nazim)and numerous Naqshbandi orders (I am not aware of any who recognise Sheikh Nazim as the 'Sheikh al-Islam' of their country) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 213.48.153.25 (talk) 10:24, 13 March 2007 (UTC).

I have removed that section as it is utterly baseless. Turkey has neither a grand Mufti nor a Sheikh al-Islam and I doubt Cyprus has either.

Edit war

Recently there has been an edit war between an IP address editor and other editors. The IP address editor is focusing on editing the sections about the Naqshbandi-Haqqani branch and denounces it as being a fake sufi order. The other editors are reverting these changes to one of the older versions. I have requested semi-protection to prevent this. 210.251.245.201 05:46, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

It hasn't ended... this article is currently riddled with anti-Haqqani rhetoric. I think they may well be a fairly controversial order, and at the very least are trying to have a large internet presence and have tried to put general articles here into their context... which would be fair to note... but the current text is a little much. – cacahuate ^talk 01:19, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

BismillahirRahmanirRahim

My name is Abdul Muzammil. I have tried to neutrilize the Haqqaniya-Naqshbandiyya Section.

Editorial vengiance !

Its absolutely uncourteous to damn one or the other branch as "fake". What sort of criteria does one use to make one tariqa original and the other fake ? And who is the authority to do so? Its very unfortunate that some editors deem the haqqani order as "fake" without any respected or well known reference. You just cannot allow this sort of personal vengeance to be present in an encyclopedia. Not only do these editors pursue intra-tariqa feud, but also prevent any other more neutral version to be present in the wiki. That is a heinous crime ! Farseemm 15:47, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I am new to this and hope im not breaking any rules and if i do then that is not my intention. I have been trying to research more into a passage from the main article but have not had any success. If anyone can help me then please contact me on xs11ax@yahoo.co.uk. Thank you. The passage i am trying to research is as follows...

'Current shaikh is Hazrat Baig Sahab. Headquarters for this branch is near Mianwali pakistan.As far as Maulana Akram Awan is concerned, he was entitled with khilafat( some years ago) and then his involvement in prohibited affairs including power politics(Tanzeem Al-Ikhwan)in pakistan caused expulsion from Khilafat(a place in order).'

Sources and links

Although this seems to be a pretty good article, it cites virtually no sources, and it has an external links section almost as long as the body of the article. I hesitate to put a sourcing tag on the article, which might give an sense to readers that there is something wrong with it, but it really does need better sourcing. Malcolm Schosha (talk) 17:02, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

Recent additions

The latest additions are uncited, do not use the format required of Wikipedia:MOSISLAM (use plain names, do not use honourifics or "tag lines" like (SAW), etc.) and appears to emply an curious word usages. I have removed them until valid, cited sources can be added. ناهد/(Nåhed) _speak! 07:19, 30 September 2008 (UTC)