Talk:Nick Cordero

Death date

Nick's death has not been confirmed. The original website to publish his passing (showbiz411) is not a reliable source, and the obituaries used as sources in recent edits can be submitted by anyone and are not proof of passing. Raseon (talk) 00:53, 6 July 2020 (UTC) Raseon

Please stop posting that he died based on the showbiz411 site. They based their article off of someone's tweet that has since been deleted. Please wait for confirmation from family, an agent, or a more reliable source. gobonobo ^{+ c} 01:18, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

@Jasonbres: Sorry, didn't see the what the second reference was. The People source seems sufficient. gobonobo ^{+ c} 01:21, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

Naijafile reference

I've repeatedly removed the Naijafile source as it is not a reliable source. Is there a reason it keeps getting added back? [1] gobonobo ^{+ c} 02:49, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

Stage career

It seems odd that the article primarily discusses Cordero's stage career, but the tables only include his TV and film work. JezGrove (talk) 22:49, 6 July 2020 (UTC)

Exactly. I was thinking the very same thing. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:44, 7 July 2020 (UTC)

I just added the television/film boxes yesterday. Is there an IMDB equivalent for theatre performers? KidAd (talk) 01:47, 7 July 2020 (UTC)

@KidAd: Thanks for adding the info. To answer your question ... Yes ... see here:

• Nick Cordero at the Internet Broadway Database
• Nick Cordero at the Internet Off-Broadway Database

Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:49, 7 July 2020 (UTC)

Amputation

Was his leg amputated from SARS-CoV-2 complications, or from ECMO? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.169.69 (talk) 04:54, 9 July 2020 (UTC)

Cause of death in the infobox

His battle with Covid was extremely well covered by the media throughout the whole battle. It is absolutely notable enough to be included in the infobox. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 17:08, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Getting media attention is not the determining factor. What is your evidence that it is significant to his notability? Nikkimaria (talk) 01:24, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

Media coverage is what makes things notable. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 13:56, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

Media coverage determines whether something can be a standalone article - if you want to make an article about his death that's best discussed elsewhere. It doesn't dictate what's included where within an existing article. Nikkimaria (talk) 20:50, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

If we don't go by media coverage, then what do we go by? My argument for including it is that there was a lot lf media coverage surrounding his battle with Covid, arguably more than his acting career ever generated. It also caused his death at a relatively young age. What exactly is your argument for not including it? JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 21:25, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

I do not agree that it is significant to his notability. We would still have an article about him had he died of something else, and if he were John Doe down the block who died of the same thing under similar circumstances we wouldn't have an article about him. Nikkimaria (talk) 21:52, 30 September 2020 (UTC)

If John Doe down the block got this much media coverage for his struggle with and eventual death from Covid, we definitely would have an article about him. We're going nowhere here though, so I'm going to stay an RFC. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 02:11, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

But John Doe wouldn't, because John Doe isn't notable to begin with. Anything having to do with celebrities tends to receive coverage. Nikkimaria (talk) 11:50, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

RFC

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Should we add his cause of death (complications from Covid-19) to the infobox? Note the above conversation. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 02:33, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

• Strong Support There has been wide media coverage of his struggle with coronavirus from the moment he got it to the moment it killed him. He was in the hospital from it for over 3 months before it killed him at the relatively young age of 41. It is also a relatively rare cause of death. There was a similar RFC at Chadwick boseman's page, with the ultimate consensus being to include his cause of death in the infobox, and most of the arguments made there for including it can be applied here. I can see no logical reason to not include it. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 02:33, 1 October 2020 (UTC)

What do you mean it is a relatively rare cause of death? This is not something to trivialize. It is already the third leading cause of death in the US. ~ HAL333([2]) 04:30, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

HAL333 by relatively rare, I mean compared to human history. Since Covid-19 hasn't been around for even a full year yet, it really is only a common cause of death if you look at the past year in isolation. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 14:22, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose As discussed above, a reliable and notable source ought to be provided to make his cause of death worthy of inclusion in the infobox, despite the media coverage regarding his illness. Idealigic (talk) 17:08, 2 October 2020 (UTC)

• If the media coverage doesn't of his struggle and eventual death from Covid doesn't count as a reliable and notable source, what on Earth would? JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 04:16, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose There is not a precedent for it. ~ HAL333([3]) 03:46, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

• @User:HAL333 Actually there is, see Talk:Chadwick_Boseman#Rfc_about_including_cause_of_death. The discussion there pointed out that the Template:Infobox person instructions are vague, but due to the death coming at a relatively young age and the media coverage of the death, it did warrant to include in the infobox. And yes, the Boseman's death received far more coverage then Cordero's death, but Boseman's acting career in general received far more coverage then Cordero's. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 17:03, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

• JDDJS Actually, that is a local consensus and an exception, not the precedent. ~ HAL333([4]) 20:17, 5 October 2020 (UTC)

• Note His widow is all over the news again because she responded Trump's reaction to getting Covid. Her response is considered relevant because of Nick's death from Covid. [5][6][7][8] When he was on the cover of People magazine, a type of media coverage that his acting career never got, it explicitly mentioned his death from Covid on the cover.[9] So many articles about him mention that he died from Coronavirus in the title of the article. [10][11][12][13] How is this not notable enough media coverage to include in the infobox? JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 14:39, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

• Oppose. Better to keep infoboxes short. The cause of death should, of course, be reported in the body of the article, and I see that it is *also* stated in the LEAD. Three times would be overkill and clutter up the infobox. I also think it is wrong to include it in Boseman's, but I didn't know about that RfC. A cause of death would not be "unusual" enough to be highlighted in an infobox unless the person is notable because of their cause of death, like, say, the original bubble boy, or some historic patient zero. -- Ssilvers (talk) 06:08, 14 October 2020 (UTC)

Note: comments after this point may have been impacted by selective notification of WikiProject COVID-19. Nikkimaria (talk) 02:30, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

Nikkimaria Why does that matter? It's obviously related to that project since we're talking about including his death from coronavirus. The notification was posted completely neutrally. The editors from their could vote either way. I also posted on the Musical Theater Wikiproject page, and the one user to come from there has opposed it. If I was trying to canvas, I would have notified the editors who voted in favor of including Chadwick Boseman's cause of death in the infobox to vote here. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 16:39, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

That would also be bad, but editors from Musical Theatre, Biography, etc, are more likely to be neutral on the question than editors specifically interested in COVID-19. Nikkimaria (talk) 17:48, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

NikkimariaThat they would anyway have a bias that they would prevent from commenting and editing neutrally just because they are interested in a topic is completely unfounded and in my opinion offensive. And since we use consensus not voting, their votes won't even matter if they don't have a policy based reason supporting it. We initially only had four editors contributing in this discussion, which isn't really enough in my opinion to gather a clear consensus. I tried posting in Musical Theater hoping that several editors would care about this due to subject's musical theater background, but that only got one additional editor. Since his death from Covid-19 is what this debate is literally what this debate was about, I thought that the Covid project would have an opinion on this, and it would help us get enough editors to get a stronger consensus one way or another. I had no way of knowing how they would vote though. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 22:24, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

• Support I would support this, in the form of "complications from COVID-19", as his death and the cause of it has become notable. That's the spirit of the instructions from my reading; if the cause of death is the only notable thing about a person than a "Death of..." article it should be. Cordero's is probably the most prolific, so far, COVID-19 death in the world. Kingsif (talk) 02:17, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

• Weak support. The death_cause parameter for {{Infobox person}} says it should only be included when the cause of death has significance for the subject's notability, which implies that it would be valid for someone like George Floyd, but not necessarily an actor who is notable for other things. That being said, he is, as I recall, one of the first high-profile deaths from COVID-19 related causes (which involved amputations), and many sources in the media have talked about his passing, including the ones JDDJS has provided higher up. Also, an article like Naya Rivera has a cause of death listed which appears to have been accepted by editors regularly maintaining it. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 02:26, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

• Support if that's indeed (WP:V) the cause of death. ~EdGl talk 02:41, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

• That is not the sole determining factor in including it. Nikkimaria (talk) 17:48, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

• Support. As The New York Times writes here, "The death of the Broadway actor Nick Cordero from Covid-19 has shaken people far beyond the theater world, in large part because he was just 41". He became more notable than he otherwise would have been, because of his death. Paul Erik ^{(talk)(contribs)} 02:46, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
• Oppose: While I am not against listing the cause of death in an infobox when it is warranted I do not see this case as support by WP:NPOV and more specifically WP:BALASP. There is controversy over the cause of death but not of significance to make the biography more about his death. On my screen (17.5") the lead content concerning the subjects death due to COVID-19 is in very close proximity to the infobox. The proposed adding of the cause of death there would just be redundant. Unless there is a rationale concerning the infobox and other viewing screens then the addition would also be unwarranted clutter. Otr500 (talk) 03:49, 28 October 2020 (UTC)
• Support per nom. Cordero was notable prior to his Covid illness, but Covid put him in the spotlight in a completely new way. Retswerb (talk) 08:34, 28 October 2020 (UTC)

• Note Herman Cain died of coronavirus and his infobox includes COVID-19 as his cause of death. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 20:27, 12 November 2020 (UTC)

• Support per nom. While Cordero was already notable as a performer, he became one of the most high-profile people in the world to die from COVID-19, making him notable as well for that. Not mentioning his cause of death in the lead or infobox seems as if we would be missing something so significantly attached to a notability far beyond that of another successful working actor with a Tony nomination.--Tenebrae (talk) 21:17, 12 November 2020 (UTC)

• Support per nom and JDDJS --TDKR Chicago 101 (talk) 07:54, 13 November 2020 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

BLPNAME

I have removed the name of the son under WP:BLPNAME. This contentious issue is currently being discussed in an RFC at Talk:Amanda Kloots#RFC about including sons name. The name should not be reinstated unless there is consensus to include per WP:ONUS. Morbidthoughts (talk) 22:55, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

The RFC is now closed with no consensus to include. Morbidthoughts (talk) 00:48, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

Waitress Tribute

This week, an addition was made to the set of Waitress as a tribute to Cordero - the sign which lists the diner's pies now starts off with the "Live Your Life Pie", which is named after Cordero's song "Live Your Life". I wanted to add this to his page (and possibly the Waitress page as well), but I was uncertain of how to do so.

Links: Official Twitter and article

I hope someone can find a way to include this in the article. --Redandsymmetry (talk) 18:49, 26 August 2021 (UTC)