Talk:ORP Kujawiak (L72)

ORP Kujawiak

Hi-

I’m obviously not a wikipedia expert but I’m puzzled as to why you made small and pertinent edits to this page for months and then yesterday deleted all information about the search for the wreck and its discovery, noting “Wreck of kujawiak, that’s all that needs to be said.”

Ovbiously it was my father’s ship and I was involved in finding it. Was that inappropriate to mention?

“A team of Divers” hardly describes the months of research and preparation, coordination between two sovereign nations, and involvement of University personnel and independent explorers and marine archaeologists.

There are numerous wikipedia pages detailing the location of wrecks, their discoverers, etc. I’m just trying to understand why you felt none of the information was warranted.

Is there a better way the information can be added? Perhaps on another page?

Thanks for your time.

Chris Chriskraska (talk) 01:09, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Hi, Chriskraska it appears your question is directed to Lyndaship. I won't speak for her, but will say that she is an experienced editor that knows how to improve articles. Also, I will add that per your comments here, you should familiarize yourself with Wikipedia's Conflict of Interest guidelines. I would strongly suggest that you do not make any edits to this article, and instead continue to communicate here on the talk page. If you have any changes you would like to see made, please suggest them here, (be sure to include reliable sources) and another editor can review and possibly make the edit(s) for you. Thanks - wolf 10:31, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Thanks for the ping Wolf - I missed this post on the talk page. In answer to the question I deleted nearly all the info about the wreck finding primarily because I thought it wasn't warranted, the article is about the ship and the subsequent finding of its wreck is really a footnote to its history. I disliked the list of bare names associated with its finding, maybe I should have left the principle one. The sources did not seem too good to me, the salient points I thought was had the wreck been designated by the Maltese government and I couldn't find a source which said yes it had and the recovery of the bell which was unsourced. I have no problem if you want to expand the wreck finding and diving info a bit but bear in mind it should not overpower the info we have on the ship. Obviously the months of effort your team put in is less important than the Polish sailors who lost their lives in the sinking and we not memorialise them so why should we mention a group of divers by name? Lyndaship (talk) 10:43, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Thanks to both of you for your thoughtful and well stated responses. I will assemble sources for the information regarding the involvement of the Maltese and Polish governments and the protection of the wreck which was visibly damaged by commercial shipping between our series of dives. I will also suggest a small blurb about the search and discovery of the wreck for your review along with a link to the 90 page Explorers Club flag report when I have a chance.

Thank you.

Chris — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chriskraska (talk • contribs) 12:31, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Having noted the potential COI I've added a bit to the prose to make it easier for you. The other refs in the original text added nothing, the orpkujawiak one has been hijacked and the gdansk radio one when I finally got beyond their latest news page to the article said nothing of significance. Likewise my quick google search only turned up primary sources, company sites, social media and regurgitated press releases none of which were usable or added anything more to what is already there and sourced. I expect you will do a deeper search and find something which can be used Lyndaship (talk) 13:13, 20 November 2018 (UTC)

Hi-

I have these references for a start. Thank you.

Chris

Article detailing the designation of the wreck site as a protected area prohibiting diving.

https://www.rp.pl/artykul/1208573-Kujawiak-pod-szczegolnym-nadzorem.html

Article detailing the planned creation of a 3D map of the wreck site and the effort to locate and recover the ship’s bell.

https://wpolityce.pl/historia/290707-ekspedycja-do-wraku-polskiego-niszczyciela-orp-kujawiak-przypomina-o-chwale-marynarki-wojennej-rp

Article detailing the recovery and conservation of the ship’s bell and the placement of a commemorative marble plaque in the Upper Barrakka Gardens in Valetta, Malta (a UNESCO World Heritage site).

https://dzieje.pl/artykuly-historyczne/wydobyty-przez-nurkow-dzwon-niszczyciela-orp-kujawiak-odzyskal-dawny-blask?fbclid=IwAR2zY2MBJfclFiNq2cKUOpLt7HbKobgcFPsXkQbg_qVs9l99wC46E36f8dc user chriskraska — Preceding unsigned comment added by Chriskraska (talk • contribs) 20:34, 22 November 2018 (UTC)