Talk:Oceanic feeling

incomplete reference

Is the 2nd ref to Jon Mills

THE ONTOLOGY OF RELIGIOSITY: THE OCEANIC FEELING AND THE VALUE OF THE LIVED EXPERIENCE (1999). JON MILLS, PSY. D., PH. D. ? G. Robert Shiplett 09:28, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

relevant links

Because of neurological work of the last decades, there should be a link.

Surely there should be a See Also to Wm James for "Varieties of religious Experience"

G. Robert Shiplett 09:35, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

Ramakrishna & epilepsy

As far as I know, Roland based his decription of the "oceanic feeling" on Ramakrishna, who may have suffered from epilepsy. The "oceanic feeling" may thus be a description of the subjective experience of an epipeltic seizure. There's some irony here, since Freud described "hysteria," which also may have neuro-pathological origins. Compare, by the way, the following comment by Ramana Maharshi on his "second death experience" in 1912, in which he was unconscious for a while. Arthur Osborne, Roaming and a Death Experience in 1912, "From Ramana Maharshi and the Path of Self Knowledge," p.62 (emphasis mine):

"Later, to correct wrong accounts that began to be spread, he added: "I did not bring on the fit purposely, nor did I wish to see what this body would look like after death, nor did I say that I will not leave this body without warning others. It was one of those fits that I used to get occasionally, only this time it took a very serious form."

What is, perhaps, most striking about this experience is that it was a repetition, heightened by actual physical demonstration, of that certainty of endurance through death which had constituted Sri Bhagavan's spiritual awakening. It recalls the verse from Thayumanavar, the Tamil classic which Sri Bhagavan often quoted: "When overpowered by the wide Expanse which is without beginning, end or middle, there is the realization of non-dual bliss.""

Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 22:09, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

Ah yes: J.M Masson, The Oceanic Feeling: The Origins of Religious Sentiment in Ancient India, p.36. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 22:11, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

And check out this one: G.K. Pillai (2015), Monks are from Meditating Monkeys: Unravelling the Algorithm of True Spiritual Awakening: "He candidly admitted that the second incident was a "fit", which was the common parlance reference for an epileptic seizure." Unfortunately self-published, but the same hypothesis. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 22:23, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

First sentence...

... needs a full stop after "... and Its Discontents (1929/1930)". What follows: "...to criticize the psychological feeling of religion, the "oceanic" feeling of limitlessness." is incomprehensible to me. What is the oceanic feeling? I don't find an answer here... This probably needs a citation from Roland. --Herbmuell (talk) 09:27, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

I tried to improve the introduction, and eliminated a few words. --Herbmuell (talk) 09:38, 25 September 2016 (UTC)

Neurotheology

@Mauro Lanari: I'd replaced th section on neurotheoly with information on temporal lobe epilepsy, because the section does not contain information about Ramakrishna. I've checked the sources; On Being certain makes no references to oceanic feeling or Ramakrishna, nor does Why God Won't Away. What's more, the Newberg-quote says

intensely focused spiritual contemplation triggers an alteration in the activity of the brain that leads one to perceive transcendent religious experiences as solid, tangible reality. In other words, the sensation that Buddhists call oneness with the universe.

That's typically not what happened to Ramakrishna, who had spontaneous "samadhi's," c.q. ecstacy's, or absences (nb: Ramana Maharshi's famous silence in response to questions may have been an 'acquired' application of absences). I think that neurotheology is highly relevant to the topic, but this way it is a mild form of WP:OR, unfortunately. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 07:44, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

Are you stating that the oceanic feeling, defined in the lead section as "the sensation of being one with the universe", would be a different concept from the feeling of oneness with the universe, and that supporting the opposite would be an original research? Please take a look at Google Books. Ramakrishna is just one case, not the only one. M.L. --84.223.150.138 (talk) 09:03, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for adding the sources! I thought the the sources were inline... See WP:BURDEN for the section on neurotheology. The section referenced by Burton does not give an explanation, on;y a description of what neurotheology is. The section refrenced by Newberg describes "intensely focused spiritual contemplation," whereas Roland refers to "spontaneous religious sentiment" (Parsons (1999), The Enigma of the Oceanic Feeling, p.36. Roland refers to spontaneous mysticism (Parsons p.37). So, Newberg c.s. do not offer an explanation for the "oceanic feeling" as described by Roland. Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 12:45, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

Parsons and Masson offer an alternative, more suportive approach to Rolland. Their views should be shortly explained in the section on "other explanations". Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 05:10, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

Arthur Koestler

Koestler writes about the oceanic feeling in his book Darkness at Noon. 89.233.205.202 (talk) 17:20, 28 June 2023 (UTC)