Talk:Paul Tsongas

Simpsons mention

"His name was mentioned briefly, in a not-to-be-forgotten tune, on The Simpsons."

So what's the tune? If it's not-to-be-forgotten, let's hear it. I must have forgotten it. --Feitclub 02:41, Nov 4, 2004 (UTC)

The only tune I remember is the one about C. Everett Koop -- Two Halves — Preceding undated comment added 21:29, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Dating this section Gang14 00:49, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

"Come on everybody, have some sexual congress! Not the kind of congress that contains Paul Tsongas!" - Homer Simpson, Catch 'Em If You Can, 15x18. --Jatkins ^{(talk - contribs)} 22:49, 27 December 2016 (UTC)

Favorite Tsongas quote

My favorite Tsongas quip was this one:

"If you think that the words 'government' and 'efficiency' belong in the same sentence, we have counseling available outside."

I'm sure that's close, but it might not be exactly correct. Can anyone verify it?

NCdave 04:11, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Found it:

"If anyone thinks the words 'government' and 'efficiency' belong in the same sentence, we have counseling available."

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,974992-3,00.html

NCdave 18:28, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I put it in the article. I hope nobody objects. NCdave (talk) 07:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

"A few years later the cancer returned"

What cancer? It seems like there must have been a mention of cancer in an earlier revision of this article, but that was removed without this sentence being cleaned up. 65.24.249.74 (talk) 06:04, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

The cancer was non-Hodgkins lymphoma, mentioned earlier in the article.--HughGRex (talk) 14:11, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

Ah, OK. I didn't read the article sequentially, and after I read the latter section, I searched for "cancer" with my browser and didn't find anything else. It might be nice to mention cancer in the same sentence where lymphoma is mentioned, or maybe not. If it were added, it would prevent others from making my mistake. But I'm not sure I could get the wording right. 65.24.249.74 (talk) 04:37, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Parental Units

Anybody got anything on his folks? Most notable, and not so notable, people have the names of their folks listed or mentioned clearly. Anybody got anything on Paul's Parents? Scott Anafas (talk) 15:29, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

'Tsongased'

In Orrin Hatch's autobiography he refers to the ERA hearings in which Tsongas was shown to be completely unprepared for serious questioning because he was so unprepared and fell apart (complained that he hadn't been given questions before-hand, to which Hatch replied something like, "We never give the questions before-hand.") Eventually Tsongas asked to be dismissed to catch a plane.

There is a political term created as a result of Tsongas' poor showing in the questioning, "Tsongased." As in, "I hope the Governor doesn't get 'Tsongased' if they bring up foreign investment in the debate tonight."

There should be at least some reference to this political term and the events which inspired the term. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Canadiandy (talk • contribs) 22:44, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

If you can find a source then sure Gang14 (talk) 16:38, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

"Hatch revealed Tsongas unprepared to discuss the ERA's effects on inter alia, abortion rights, fair housing, women in the militia, homosexual marriages, veterans' preference, seniority practices, insurance rate distinctions, and non-coeducational colleges." (Page 87 of 'Constitutional inequality: the political fortunes of the Equal Rights Amendment' by Gilbert Yale Steiner)

Common usage examples:
"I hope we don't [sic]"Tsongased" by a Bill Clinton-type campaigner." Retrieved August 30, 2009 from tins.rklau.com/2003/08/kerry-on-meet-press.html

"GOP or DEM and he's Tsongased in the Primaries, as someone more polished makes him look the fool." Retrieved Augist 30, 2009 from www.sporttaco.com/.../Top_5_Third_Party_Candidates_ever_3907.html

"Dean won't be Tsongased this time." Retrieved August 30, 2009 from www.dailykos.com/story/2003/10/25/231845/52. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.199.140.178 (talk) 05:43, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Hey there, me again, Canadiandy. From the Steiner reference you will also find the following which might give you a framework for the defining the term ‘Tsongased.’

“The colloquy qualifies as an ERA disaster because it made opponents seem both more knowledgeable about the subject than the supporters and more concerned about what belongs in the Constitution.” (Steiner)

based on this context, I would propose the following definition for the term ‘Tsongased,’

Tsongased: Verb (past tense) A weakening of one’s issue or cause resulting from a lack of background knowledge about the cause itself, or, the humiliation resulting from being seen as failing a debate as a result of same. (eg.) The Senator was Tsongased this evening in the debate when he couldn’t answer any of his opponent’s inquiries regarding his party’s policies on immigration reform. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.199.140.178 (talk) 07:31, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Hey all. I seem to be finding a wall of silence here. In the event that more references are needed, please consider the following from the Milwaukee Sentinel and the NWU Law review;

---

“But a second chance is not a guarantee of success. It is entirely possible to do it all over again and do it wrong. We saw a prime example of that in the Senate two weeks ago when sponsor Sen. Paul Tsongas (D-Mass.) showed up shamefully unprepared for the opening exchange with anti-ERA Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah).”

Goodman, Ellen. Editorial. P. 14. The Milwaukee Sentinel. June 10, 1983

---

The very first question posed to a witness in the ERA II hearings was Hatch’s query to Tsongas: “What precisely, in your view, is the standard of review that the equal rights amendment would establish for Federal and State legislation that employ sex classifications?” But Tsongas declined to delve deeply into the legal intricacies of the amendment. “There is no one who would argue that we have at this point an exact understanding of where it will lead,” he said at one point in the exchange. When Hatch then asked whether Tsongas agreed that the analysis set out in the Yale ERA Article remained the “definitive statement” on the amendment’s meaning, Tsongas said he had not read the article. Hatch followed up with a litany of specific questions about the ERA’s projected legal impact on everything from abortion funding, to veterans’ preferences, to seniority systems, to single sex schools, to maternity leave, to combat restrictions, to the legality of same-sex marriage. Tsongas dodged them all, emphasizing that all constitutional amendments contained some ambiguities and suggesting that Hatch had not subjected his own proposed human life (antiabortion) amendment to such a rigorous standard of certainty. The exchange grew heated. “You knew damn well that these are specific issues, that no one coming here unprepared could answer,” Tsongas shot back at one point. The Associated Press described Tsongas as “visibly shaken.” Though he continued to accuse Hatch of hypocrisy, Tsongas agreed to submit a detailed list of answers to Hatch’s questions. Thus, in the first hour of the first hearing, Hatch had both established the agenda for the remaining hearings and created the impression that the amendment’s proponents were long on platitudes and short on specifics. Even some ERA sympathizers were aghast at Tsongas’s apparent inability.

Mayeri, Serena. A New E.R.A. Or a New Era? Amendment Advocacy and the Reconstitution of Feminism. Northwestern University Law Review Vol. 103, No. 3. (2009).

---

based on these articles the history seems quite clear that Tsongas was blown out of the water and humiliated at the ERA hearings. And the fact that this pivotal moment in US legal history found Tsongas "shamefully unprepared" and "visibly shaken" deserves some recognition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.199.159.196 (talk) 11:35, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

I noticed someone reverted the "Tsongased" paragraph and didn't bother to discuss it here. I have returned it. I don't see how perhaps his largest failure (which is immortalized by a political term being coined to him by name) is not relevant or noteworthy. The context (a key hearing on the ERA) is likewise of huge importance. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.180.103.183 (talk) 07:18, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

Tsongas Dry Cleaners

I found it interesting that the article said his father "was a Greek immigrant who worked as a dry-cleaner.[1]" Having lived in Lowell and being only three years younger than Paul Tsongas, my recollection was that Tsongas Dry Cleaners was a substantial business in Lowell. A quick search of the web shows this New York Times article - Hometown Recalls Paul Tsongas as Hero Who Inspired Renewal and Pride

He was the pillar of the Lowell community, said 71-year-old Arthur C. Anton, the owner of Anton's Cleaners and a friend of Mr. Tsongas's father, who also owned a dry cleaning business, as he left the Tsongas house this evening. He had an ability to get people to respond to his vision, his dreams. We're so proud of him for what he has done for us, and what he left us.

--Steven Greenberg (talk) 20:10, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

I've just added something about Tsongas' father owning a successful dry cleaning business in Lowell. You should edit or improve upon my wording if you wish, User:Steven Greenberg. --- Professor JR (talk) 21:29, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Paul Tsongas. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080610151549/http://www.cheslog.com/craig/parrhesia/tsongascall.html to http://www.cheslog.com/craig/parrhesia/tsongascall.html
• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20091211190004/http://paultsongasarena.com/overview.asp to http://www.paultsongasarena.com/overview.asp

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 16:07, 11 December 2017 (UTC)

Victorious New Hampshire campaign

The victorious Paul Tsongas New Hampshire campaign was led by Ms. Susan Prolman of Nashua, New Hampshire, who later worked for Humane Society of the United States and National Sustainable Agriculture Coalition, both of Washington DC. MaynardClark (talk) 04:41, 9 May 2018 (UTC)

References