Talk:Pavol Hnilica
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The Lead paragraphs
editThe lead paragraphs on this page do not represent what is on the page in a balanced way. "The lead should stand on its own as a concise overview of the article's topic. It should identify the topic, establish context, explain why the topic is notable, and summarize the most important points, including any prominent controversies." [[1]]Red Rose 13 (talk) 07:23, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
- It does, well enough. Sign yourself. --Governor Sheng (talk) 04:36, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
- I will rewrite it here for us to go over. Also the section should be Our Lady of Fatima - Consecration of Russia. The consecration of Russia began with Our Lady of Fatima and it is important to differentiate this for the reader.Red Rose 13 (talk) 07:23, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
Let's go sentence by sentence. Two sentences from the lead need clarification: 1) Hnilica was part of a network of Marian apparitions around the world. 2) His organization was especially active around the promotion of the cult of the Lady of All Nations in the Netherlands.Rewriting them
- 1) Hnilica belonged to the group World Network of Marian Devotion. - This is true.
- 2) Hnilica's organization - name please ??-- also actively supported the cult of the Lady of All Nations in the Netherlands. (reference stating this please) Also Lady of all nations is a part of the World Network of Marian Devotions.Red Rose 13 (talk) 08:18, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
1/2) - It wasn't an established organisation. Sources don't mention it as such, but as a wider anti-communist phenomenon during the late stage of Cold War. So no capital letters. Also note: "Important shrines and devotions within this network include naming a few: Amsterdam (1945), Medjugorje (1981), and Garabandal, Spain (1961).[13] ". So no, there's no Fatima in it. --Governor Sheng (talk) 17:10, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
- Were you able to read the source? Yes Fatima is mentioned as being in this network on pages 1805 and 1806 The network includes all apparitions whether approved or not by the Catholic Church. The encyclopedia gives the network this name: World Network of Marian Devotion but also says it is an informal network and has no address of its own. So caps are not needed.[[2]] Red Rose 13 (talk) 19:26, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
Back to the two sentences in discussion. After considering our discussion and reading the sources:
- 1) Hnilica supported the informal network of Marian devotions world wide.
- 2) Hnilica's organization that Pope Paul VI asked him to found, Family of Mary, supported the cult of the Lady of All Nations, Amsterdam, Netherlands.
However I am not sure why we have the second sentence. It is redundant to the first one.Red Rose 13 (talk) 04:10, 14 March 2023 (UTC)
Edit Warring again
editI suggest before you edit on a controversial page that you create a discussion on the talk page and ask other editors to make comments besides me. Otherwise, we will be in the same situation as before and not allowed to edit these pages. You just deleted this paragraph for no apparent reason from the lead. "Presently Bishop Hendriks explains that the title 'Lady of All Nations' is "in itself theologically admissible" which includes praying with the Madonna but it is not to be understood as a recognition of the supernatural nature of the phenomena." I am going to revert the edits back to just before you started. Bring what you want to change to the talk page.Red Rose 13 (talk) 18:46, 13 March 2023 (UTC)