Talk:Pearl and Hermes Atoll/Archive 1

Archive 1

Untitled

I removed the Lagoons category (which I had added yesterday) and added the Pacific Ocean atolls category because atolls are defined as enclosing a lagoon. -- Dalbury^(Talk) 22:00, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was move. —Nightstallion (?) 11:37, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Requested move

Pearl and Hermes Reef → Pearl and Hermes Atoll – {Used more often, refers to whole atoll, not just reef, a part of an atoll. How it appears on maps} ----

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one-sentence explanation, then sign your opinion with quadruple tildes.

• Indifferent since both atoll and reef are both used often to refer to this geographic feature. joturner 05:25, 5 March 2006 (UTC)
• Oppose until references are cited. (and not Google hits) AjaxSmack 07:25, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Official government sources are good enough for me. —Nightstallion (?) 11:37, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Pearl and Hermes Atoll/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

First of all, separate into sections: Intro, then history, then ecology. History needs to include discovery, all subsequent explorations and/or shipwrecks, exploitation by pearl fishers, and subsequent conservation attempts. Ecology section should include all relevant species that live here. SeanMD80talk | contribs 02:20, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Last edited at 02:20, 23 March 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 02:32, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Pearl and Hermes Atoll. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080910013439/http://hawaiireef.noaa.gov/PDFs/Citizens_Guide_Web.pdf to http://hawaiireef.noaa.gov/PDFs/Citizens_Guide_Web.pdf
• Added {{dead link}} tag to http://www.hawaiianatolls.org/about/pearlhermes.php

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 17:27, 18 January 2018 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Pearl and Hermes Atoll/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Ceranthor (talk · contribs) 19:15, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

I'll be reviewing this in the next few days. ceranthor 19:15, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Lead

• "The Pearl and Hermes Atoll (Hawaiian: Holoikauaua)," - why the comma after the Hawaiian?
• "The Pearl and Hermes Atoll (Hawaiian: Holoikauaua), is part of the Northwestern Hawaiian Islands." - might be worth mentioning the Islands' location as well
• Link erosion
• "the Pearl and the Hermes, a pair of English whaleships that wrecked there in 1822" - can "wrecked" really be used as an active verb?

Geography

• "east-southeast of Midway Atoll." - "east-southeast" should have an ENDASH, not a hyphen
• link Midway Atoll
• I think the whole section could be consolidated into one paragraph, to be honest; two at most
• Usually spell out USGS at its first mention, since it's not a super common acronym to the lay reader
• What's a "fringing reef"?

Nomenclature

• Link Hawaiian monk seal?
• "The Hawaiian-language name for the atoll, Holoikauaua, was developed " - not sure developed is the best verb here... what about "determined"? any other ideas?

History

• " Pearl's sister ship" - shouldn't all of Pearl's be italicized? Or perhaps just replace with "Its" sister ship
• "46 of the survivors were rescued by the passing Earl of Morby.[9]" - what happened to the rest? unknown or presumed to have perished? clarify please
• Paragraph two should be combined with paragraph one.
• "In 1867, the crew of the Laconda produced the first reliable chart of the reef.[10]" - any more detail on this ship? why was it the first reliable chart? who was on it?
• "Entrepreneurs from a rabbit canning business intentionally released rabbits on Southeast Island in 1894, where they almost immediately devoured all the island's vegetation.[11]" - almost immediately? who was documenting it? I fear that "almost immediately" is too vague and that a more specific timeline is necessary
• "In 1930, the United States Bureau of Fisheries decided to make a thorough study of the atoll. - conduct is better than "make" a study
• "The United States Navy loaned the minesweeper ship" -what's a minesweeper ship? link if possible?
• "The salvage tug Ono " -what's a salvage tug? link if possible?
• "significant scarring in the reef." - what does this refer to? scarring seems self-explanatory but may have nuanced differences in this context, which should be explained

Flora and fauna

• "As an example, the noxious Setaria verticillata" - noxious? what does this mean?
• The first subsection can all be combined into one paragraph
• "Surveys in 1994 and 2000 had similar results - very vague; do they have exact numbers?
• "The Pearl and Hermes Atoll supports breeding populations of endangered Hawaiian monk seals " - Hawaiian monk seals can be delinked, since it should be linked at its first mention
• "In 2016, scientists from the Bishop Museum, working with the NOAA, described a new species of butterflyfish found off the Pearl and Hermes Atoll, at a depth of 180 feet" - should provide a conversion from ft to meters using {{Convert}}; also, throughout the article you've used primarily km and converted to miles, so you should do the same here for consistency

Conservation efforts

• "In 2014, a net tangle weighing 11.5 tons was located in the atoll." - conversion?
• "It was 28 feet long, 7 feet wide, and 16 feet deep, and took three days to dismantle and remove.[25]"
• Also, same note about starting with km and converting to miles for consistency for both above comments; as well as this bit: "The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency projects that sea level will rise 13–16 inches (33–41 cm) by 2100. Southeast Island is only 3 feet (1 m) above sea level, "

Climate

• "Despite being located at 27°48'N, which is above the Tropic of Cancer, Pearl and Hermes Atoll features a tropical savanna climate (Köppen Aw) with very pleasant year-round temperatures. Rainfall is evenly distributed throughout the year, with only two months being able to be classified as dry season months (May and June)." - this needs a citation

References/General

• No dablinks.
• Does ref 4 have a page number?
• References mostly seem reliable.
• The weatherbase.com link (ref 26) doesn't seem to work.
• Checks out with the Earwig tool... a few notes though.
• "one of two recorded Hawaiian nest sites of little terns" - this phrasing is a little too close to the source for my comfort; reword if possible
• "despite being considered rare in the rest of the Hawaiian archipelago." - this is close to the source as well, rephrase

Good work. Might have a few more comments, but this article is in good shape. ceranthor 21:11, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

Hi, sorry about the long delay in responding. I'll be taking a crack at the suggested fixes in the next couple of hours. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 02:09, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Also, the "later wrecks and site exploration" section got a bit large, so I split it into (this will surprise you) "later wrecks" and "site exploration" as two separate sections. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 09:55, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Responses

Okay, I've made most the fixes as suggested, with some commentary below:

Lead

• can wrecked" really be used as an active verb? --> I think so, like in "I wrecked my car".

Geography

• "east-southeast of Midway Atoll." - "east-southeast" should have an ENDASH, not a hyphen --> no, it's a name of a direction (see Points of the compass#16-wind compass rose)
• link Midway Atoll --> it was already linked where it says "behind Midway and Kure"
• What's a "fringing reef"? --> apparently it's a kind of reef that forms in shallow waters, I linked it and expanded to "the fringing coral reef which surrounds the atoll" to make it a little more clear

Nomenclature

• "The Hawaiian-language name for the atoll, Holoikauaua, was developed " --> I went with "established", but am open to changes

History

• "46 of the survivors were rescued by the passing Earl of Morby.[9]" - what happened to the rest? --> second paragraph stated that the 11 remaining built a little ship and sailed to Hawaii, but I made explicit that 11 were left behind in para 1.
• "In 1867, the crew of the Laconda produced the first reliable chart of the reef.[10]" - any more detail on this ship? why was it the first reliable chart? who was on it? --> no clue. The oldest source I found about it was written in 1931, and even that just said "it went, it charted, it came home". Zero detail available to me.

Conservation efforts

• "In 2014, a net tangle weighing 11.5 tons was located in the atoll." - conversion? --> what should it be converted to?
• Also, same note about starting with km and converting to miles for consistency --> I realized it was better for all the measurements to be SI since it's an American location, so I flipped everything to display miles, and added conversions for everything that didn't have one, except tons as noted above

Climate

• this needs a citation --> I clarified that the weather data was from Midway, and added a citation

References/General

• The weatherbase.com link (ref 26) doesn't seem to work. --> works for me, I'm not sure what's not working for you
• rephrase requests --> I rephrased both slightly. They're both US federal gov't sources, so for what it's worth, copyvio isn't a concern.

Thank you for your in-depth assessment. I appreciate the thorough look. While going through and making the suggested fixes, I have also added some information here and there, as well as some photographs. ♠PMC♠ (talk) 07:23, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

@Premeditated Chaos: Sorry for the delayed response. I've been traveling for a few days. I will check these ASAP. ceranthor 20:17, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

No problem, looking forward to it! ♠PMC♠ (talk) 23:38, 15 June 2018 (UTC)

Fixed the ton issue and a separate ref format issue. Otherwise, my comments have been fixed. I'll pass this now. ceranthor 16:02, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Thanks again for your review, I appreciate it! ♠PMC♠ (talk) 14:08, 17 June 2018 (UTC)