Talk:Peter Rainier (Royal Navy officer, born 1784)/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Zawed (talk · contribs) 09:25, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

I will take a gander at this one in the next few days. Zawed (talk) 09:25, 29 September 2021 (UTC)

@Zawed Not looking to rush you, I'm fine with waiting, but do you have an ETA for this at all? Thanks, Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 18:10, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, got distracted with other Wiki projects. Comments as follows:

Lead

• Link Captain at the very start Not done I think it more appropriate to link the post-captain later on in the lede, as otherwise it might cause confusion to those who don't know the ranks are one and the same (per reply later in text here). I'd do both but then it'd be suffering from a case of duplicated links-itis. Happy to hear further suggestions on this minor, but frustrating, point!
• Through the patronage of his uncle...; suggest replacing "Through" with "Due" to avoid repeated usage of that word. Done
• I think specie may be an unfamiliar term, perhaps bullion coin (to which specie links)? Done
• Also, suggest adding age at death to infobox Done

Early life

• Just a suggestion, but given the importance that Peter Rainier (senior) played in his career, perhaps call him out here as one of the family members in the RN who significantly influenced his career? Not done - went with your second suggestion re this

Naval career

• Presumably he started his career as a midshipman? Not done - possible, but I don't think it clear enough to be added in the article. The source used states that "At the age of 10 he went to sea with James Vashon in the Pompee". This is one of the more recent sources to discuss Rainier's career and uses archival information to provide that detail, while earlier sources seemingly didn't have access to those records and don't discuss his early years in such detail at all. While midshipman was traditionally the rank a budding officer would join their first ship in, this wasn't automatic and thus I'm wary in putting it in the article if the source doesn't outright say it. For example, Benjamin William Page joined as a first class volunteer, Sir Robert Howe Bromley, 3rd Baronet as a captain's servant, and Anthony Maitland, 10th Earl of Lauderdale as an admiral's servant.

• Agree, better not to speculate if not known. Zawed (talk) 03:10, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

• The commander in chief there was his uncle...; if you prefer not to change the early life section, suggest here "The commander in chief there was another uncle, his godfather Vice-Admiral Peter Rainier" Done
• of which the crew informed him; suggest "the crew of which informed him" Done
• Link Batavia Roads? Done - there is no article for the particular location but I've linked roadstead
• was also there along ; need to clarify where "there" is: Onroost or Batavia Roads? It only becomes obvious later. Done - clarified she was at Batavia
• The battle between the two frigates...; this starts a very long sentence, suggest breaking it up (as an aside, his conduct and leadership for such a young chap is impressive) Done - split into two sections and took the opportunity to do some light rewording too. Hope that works.
• Link Philippine Company? Also note my comment above RE specie Half done - corrected specie. Really not sure what to link the PC to.
• and their smaller consorts.[21][22][15]; suggest reordering the refs here Done
• to hunt for these two ships in June; repetitive language "two ships", suggest rephrasing to avoid (and to improve clarity) Done
• sailing home to decommission her; decommission? The Niger was a practically a new ship? - indeed she was. Coincidentally I just finished writing up Samuel Jackson (Royal Navy officer) who happens to have commanded Niger after Rainier. Decommissioning a ship was not such a final event as it is nowadays; if after not having a captain for a bit, a ship then received a new one, he'd simply come along with his commissioning orders and recommission her from whatever state she was left in. There is in fact no source that gives an exact date for when Rainier left Niger and she was decommissioned, but Jackson recommissioned her in August 1815, so she wasn't idle for long. Despite being a relatively new ship, Jackson had to abandon her on the North America Station in 1817 and go home in a transport because she was in such a poor state that they decided to just break her up where she was!
• I was initially confused by the absence of his promotion to captain which I understood to be a senior rank to post-captain. Then I read the post-captain article. Do you have a source for a note to the effect that a post-captain is styled as a captain? If not, maybe delete Captain from the start of the lead and amend the infobox to post-captain. Half done While the rank was post-captain, I expect an officer would have been laughed out of the navy if he addressed someone as "post captain xxx"! I've never seen the full form of the rank used in any source when addressing or introducing a man who held the rank. I've changed the infobox as you suggested to make the rank itself more obvious.

• I don't see the need for this to hold up GA promotion, but if you take this to A-Class, it is possible that a reviewer may want some clarity on this which I think a note, to the effect that a post-captain is styled a captain, will resolve. Zawed (talk) 03:10, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

I'll have a look and see what I can find for that. I've dithered around thinking about putting something up for A-Class for a while now so who knows if this'll go there, but I agree the clarification is probably necessary nonetheless. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk) 11:07, 9 October 2021 (UTC)

References

• There is inconsistency in the capitalisation of "Company" in the name of the publishers.  Not done - I copy publisher details down verbatim from the source and think they should probably stay that way? I can't change the Marshall and O'Byrne references even if I wanted to because they're a template.

Image tags

• These check out OK. The portrait is quite striking: he comes across as a very confident young man. - it's a good one, isn't it? The things nepotism can do to one!

Apologies for the delay in getting onto this. Cheers, Zawed (talk) 00:56, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

@Zawed: Thanks for doing it at all! I've done my best to answer your comments. Pickersgill-Cunliffe (talk)

I am happy with the edits and responses above. I am passing as GA as I believe that this article meets the necessary criteria. Zawed (talk) 03:10, 9 October 2021 (UTC)