Talk:Photographic plate

Largest glass negative text added to lede - failed verification tag

Citation is a reference [1] to a library listing for an exhibition catalog, which contains no information supporting the text regarding the “world’s largest glass negative” being held in the collection of the State Library of New South Wales. Added sentence breaks up the flow of the existing sentence regarding the transition from wet collodion to dry gelatin plates. The added sentence does not indicate the type of glass negative and does not belong in the lede. NotaBene 14:13, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

NotaBene I will adjust citation to go directly to the published source which confirms that State Library NSW holds the world's largest wet-collodion process glass negatives known to exist.Margot.l.riley (talk) 05:58, 15 March 2016 (UTC)

Margot.l.riley The first ref you addd, the catalog from an exhibition at the State Library of New South Wales still does not support the claim you added here [2] which was removed for failed verification. It does not indicate the image subject, whether it still exists, where it is located and mentions a length of "10 m". It does not mention whether this is a glass plate or a print from several plates. Your second reference, a listing of the holdings of the Art Gallery of New South Wales,[3] states the gallery holds "5 albumen photographs", but does not mention that they have the glass plates from which the prints were made. The 5 individual prints range in size from 21.7 x 27.1 cm to 21.9 x 28.8 cm per sheet. Your statement that the largest existing wet plates in the world are held by this gallery are not supported by the references you provided.

Lastly, your replacement of this sentence breaks up the flow of the lede. The lede is supposed to be a summary of the article. The first paragraph discusses the topic in general, and a the discussion of the size of prints is in the second paragraph. Your replaced sentence in the first paragraph breaks up the flow of the lede, and was moved. The unsupported references were tagged NotaBene ^Talk 11:43, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

NotaBene I have further adjusted citations (with page refs and note to specific paragraph) and added measurements which verify the claim that State Library NSW holds the world's largest wet-collodion process glass negatives known to exist. The Art Gallery NSW citation is referring to the negs held at SLNSW. Margot.l.riley (talk) 01:16, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

• Margot.l.riley The citations do not state what you claim they state, and do nothing to verify the claims you made in this article and in the Bernhardt Holtermann article. Since you deleted the failed verification tags, after I stated that the sources did not support your edits, I will break this down slowly. You persist in making the following erroneous statement based on misinterpretation of two references:

"The world's largest wet process collodion glass plate negatives known to survive, measuring 53 inches (1.35m) x 37 inches (0.94m), are held at the State Library of New South Wales.[3][4]"

I have previously reviewed your references and tagged them for failing verification AFTER VERIFYING the material was not in the text provided. Specifically the relevant passage on page 12 of the Exhibition catalog you cite [Davies, Alan. "Exhibition guide - The Greatest Wonder of the World" (PDF). State Library of New South Wales. p. 12] states verbatim:

"The venture was to cost Holtermann over £4000, but resulted in the production of the world’s largest wet plate negatives and several panoramas. One measuring 10 m long impressed audiences overseas and received the Bronze award at the Philadelphia Centennial Exhibition of 1876 and a Silver Medal at the Paris Exposition Universelle Internationale in 1878."

This citation says that Bayliss made the largest collodion plate in the world (at the time of its creation in 1875), and mentions a size of “10 meters” which refers to the size of multiple concatenated panoramic images, not the size of a single wet plate, without any other dimensions, and does not state that the negatives still exist nor that they are held by the Library of New South Wales as you claim. The size of “10 m” given in the reference does not match the dimensions you give in your edit, so the ref does not support the statement. Ergo, the failed verification tag.

Nor does the second reference support your claim. Let’s go through this step by step. Go to your citation:[4] Now go to the Details sections[5]:

What does it say? Let’s read it together:

• Date - 1875
• Media category - Photograph
• Materials used - 5 albumen photographs, cloth-backed (emphasis added)

The 2nd ref says that the Gallery owns 5 albumen photographs – albumen prints are positives made from a glass negative. The sizes given are for the cloth-back positive albumen prints, not for the glass collodion plates that you claim. Nothing in either source nor anywhere on the Library website mentions they hold the largest glass plates, only that the Holtermann collection has the largest numerical collection of glass plates. The article is about glass plates, not albumen prints. Your statement, that the Library owns the largest dimensional glass plates is not supported anywhere in either citation, nor in the list of holdings I located at [6]. Since you cannot find a proper citation to support this claim, and you have deleted the failed verification tag without providing proper sourcing, without Talk page consensus, and persist in adding unsourced and unverifiable information to Wikipedia I am deleting your edit, and am cautioning you regarding edit warring.

Lastly, be advised that if you are affiliated with an organization and are adding information regarding that institution, it may constitute a conflict of interest and if the information is not otherwise published in verifiable sources, that would constitute a violation of the Wikipedia no original research core policy. NotaBene 鹰百利 ^Talk 04:21, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

External links modified

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I have just added archive links to one external link on Photographic plate. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/20160109194558/http://harrowphotos.com/ to http://www.harrowphotos.com

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http://www.harrowphotos.com/ gave up its domain around April 2011. Cyberbot II linked to a deadlink. I modified the archive to the last active date, viz., April 17, 2009. The website mentions that they are the repository for a collection of glass plate negatives from 1870 to 1970, and this is used to support the assertion in this article that glass plates were being used until the 1970's. This is not a particularly good reference to support the statement. I will update the archived web URL but will look for a better source for contemporary use of photographic glass plates. NotaBene 13:35, 8 February 2016 (UTC)