Talk:Punch the Clock

Pills and Soap single release

@Zmbro: you probably know what to do about this - I know "Pills and Soap" had a single release, but considering it was under a pseudonym ("The Imposter") and seemed to be a very limited release (although still a commercial one and not necessarily a promo-only one) should it be listed in Punch the Clock's infobox alongside the two main singles? Thanks. Elephantranges (talk) 01:30, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Without doing any research yet I'd say no, but I can investigate Parkyn and see what he says. How much of this do you plan to expand? I'm still on the fence about giving it the full expansion. – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 02:25, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

You talking the infobox or the full article? I was thinking of trying to add as much as I could to the article (at least stuff that deserves to be there ofc).

That being said so far it seems a lot harder to find information about this one compared to say, Imperial Bedroom or This Year’s Model which I guess makes sense. Elephantranges (talk) 03:25, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Appreciate the willingness to expand! I have access to all the bios so I know it shouldn't take too long. Only problem is if I do this one I'll feel incentivized to do Goodbye Cruel World as well..... – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 12:15, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Good to know! (P.S. I started listening to him around March this year but after what I've heard about Goodbye Cruel Word I'm a bit scared to listen... Elephantranges (talk) 14:04, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

I haven't heard that one (given its reputation) but I've heard King of America and Blood & Chocolate and those aren't that bad actually. Also, remember to source everything you add :-) – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 14:16, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

I'm saying f it and am gonna do it. Btw, I really helpful resource is the EC wiki. It's how I've gotten almost everything (besides the books) :-) – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 15:56, 18 October 2022 (UTC) Elephantranges

Good to know! I was avoiding that as usually those fan-wikis don't have a lot of sources listed, but I'll check that one out. Elephantranges (talk) 16:20, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Hey, just took a look at the bibliography section on that site - clicked 1983 and damn there is a ton here. Is there any publication in particular that tends to have the best info? Thanks. Elephantranges (talk) 18:56, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

Just check out any of the stuff I've used for the previous articles and you'll do good. Btw I'll be posting my progress so far in my sandbox in a few hours and I already have a TON. To answer your question that started this thread I can confirm the "Pills and Soap" single release (I'll have that listed in my sandbox too). – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 19:34, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

So should "Pills and Soap" be added to the infobox singles list? Same question goes for "Shipbuilding" which did recieve a single release under the Elvis Costello name, just in Japan, though.

also, should I hold off on any more edits to the page until you’ve implemented what’s in your sandbox, or is that going to be more of a long-term thing you’re doing. Thanks Elephantranges (talk) 01:15, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

Sounds good! Elephantranges (talk) 20:51, 18 October 2022 (UTC)

I'm not to what extent it is covered, if at all, in Costello's biogs or resources but Barney Bubbles designed a (fantastic) sleeve for Punch the Clock, front and back covers, that got rejected by the label. It's sadly quite an important episode in Barney's life as it was one of a string of rejected projects at the end of his life. My point anyway is I believe that it is mentioned in quite a few Barney Bubbles things online, so if the Costello research doesn't turn anything up I can try and do some research (unfortunately the Reasons to Be Cheerful book, which I know from this reproduces the artwork so presumably discuess it, is long out of print and impossible to find, but there is now another book I want to save up for which I'm hoping shares the info).--TangoTizerWolfstone (talk) 07:31, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

@TangoTizerWolfstone: Correct me if I’m wrong, but couldn’t the Reasons to Be Cheerful book be used as a citation anyways as long as you can confirm that the information cited did come from it? Elephantranges (talk) 12:21, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

@@Elephantrangers: It could but having not read it I wouldn't know the chapter or page number, and I'm not sure exactly what about the BB artwork is written in the book (but for citing the existence of the Bubbles sleeve alone, the Eye Magazine link above could suffice I suppose).--TangoTizerWolfstone (talk) 07:27, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

I'll check the bios to see if they say anything. I haven't checked Hinton yet but if any of them will say anything it would be him. – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 13:51, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

I can confirm that Hinton does give a very detailed description of Bubbles' original artwork that I will include in my expansion. – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 15:20, 24 October 2022 (UTC)

That's great news, nice.--TangoTizerWolfstone (talk) 18:55, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

@Zmbro: Sorry to ask again, but should I hold off on any big edits until you’ve been able to implement what you’ve got in your sandbox? Just wouldn’t want to spend time working on this one just for it to get replaced in a bit, y’know. Thanks! Elephantranges (talk) 14:18, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

I'd say yeah. With how much progress I've already made I'll probably get done with it next week. And I get ya I'd feel the same way. I will say though with what I've found so far I think "Pills and Soap" warrants its own article... – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 14:50, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

Yeah I wasn't aware that not only was it a single, but it was one of his highest charting songs (5th highest in a tie with "(I Don't Want to Go to) Chelsea" Elephantranges (talk) 19:36, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

@Zmbro: Hey just out of curiosity, how's it coming along? Elephantranges (talk) 01:19, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Only three more sections. Wanna finish it this weekend. – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 03:05, 29 October 2022 (UTC)

Elephantranges Done. – zmbro _{(talk) (cont)} 01:24, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

@Zmbro: looks great man!

was surprised to see that the reviews for this one are kinda mixed… this one’s tied with imperial bedroom for my favorite of his! Elephantranges (talk) 03:33, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

GA Review

1. Well-written

• Clearly and concisely written. Sections/paragraphs do not drag on and communicate a substantial amount of information in a cohesive, coherent, and concise manner.
• Adheres to manual of style, organized well and easy to navigate.

2. Verifiable with no original research

• Substantial amount of information from trustworthy and verifiable books/biographies and other good sources. References are displayed properly and in an organized fashion.
• No original research that I can see, no plagiarism, everything looks properly cited.
• No media that violates copyright.

3. Broad in its coverage

• All the basics of an album article - background on its creation, its recording, its style and arrangements/genre, discussion of the songs themselves, the album’s critical and commercial reception and the artist’s opinion of the work - can be found here, written well, not overly specific but provides a substantial amount of relevant information in an easy-to-read manner.
• Other aspects, like tracklist, chart positions, critics’ scores, are also organized well and formatted properly.

4. Neutral

• Article is unbiased and only features the opinions of other, qualified sources (critics, Costello himself). Does not contain the biases of the writer of this article.

5. Stable

• No recent edit wars.

6. Illustrated

• Album cover in infobox
• Pictures of contributors to the album included
• An appropiate amount of quotes from Costello

• All media here is relevant
• All media here does not violate copyright and is used properly

Note

This is my first attempt at reviewing a good article nominee, everything written here is based off of my interpretation of Wikipedia’s instructions for nominating a good article. If this is too short, or if there’s anything done wrong, please feel free to let me know! Hopefully this suffices.

As a side note, you’ll see above that I discussed working on this page before its expansion a few months ago. Despite this, I did not end up making any edits (at least any substantial ones) to this page; none of the work on this article that contributes to its nomination is mine, so this isn’t me nominating or reviewing an article I put any of my own substantial work or writing into.