Talk:Queue (hairstyle)

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BetacommandBot 03:54, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Article name

Why does this use the obscure word 'queue' when 'pigtail' is far more widely used? Also, some etymology would help - I assumed it was some transliteration of the Chinese, until I checked it and found it was from an old French would for 'tail' (see here). Any thoughts? Malick78 (talk) 17:41, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

This article definitely need to mention the etymology. Care to add that information to the main page? Bennylin (talk) 00:16, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

"Queue" has a pretty specific meaning; it's a kind of pigtail (for which we also have an article), but the two aren't exactly synonyms. Kafziel ^{Complaint Department} 18:39, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Is that an opinion? I see it more like gender issue. Queue is masculine, where pigtail is feminime. Bennylin (talk) 00:16, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Women?

The Hairstyles of a Manchu Women is not mentioned. Obsessions28 (talk) 08:30, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

My take on "women?" are that the term "pigtail" is used for women, while "queue" is for men. So in the sentence, "She wears a pigtail, while he wears a queue" denotes to the same hairstyle. My comment on your question is that it's no different than today's East Asian women, IMHO. Bennylin (talk) 00:16, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

I have added a link to the new article on Liangbatou hairstyle/hairpiece of Manchu women.--Librarianhelen (talk) 16:59, 28 May 2019 (UTC)

Unique

I saw WPCHINA in this page, so is queue 'unique' to China or originated there? I don't think so. I added stub-section about European queue as I saw some pictures of European men (nobles probably) wearing queue (either natural hair or fake I don't know) from the Commons. Anyone with European background care to expand the information? Bennylin (talk) 00:16, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Also, another information is needed whether queue is stricly one braided a-la Manchurian or two-braided version also considered to be a queue. As far as I know I've only seen pictures of Native American with two braided 'queues' (or are they pigtails?) If two braided 'tails are also queue, then many Chinese girls in Mao's era, who commonly wore this style of hair, would be in paradox with the definition of Chinese queue, where people (men) cut off their queue as a sign of the bygone era. Bennylin (talk) 00:26, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Main reason for Manchu men to wear queue, is that they were both herdmen and warriors wearing headgear(or helmet), so they had to shave off most of the hair to prevent the helmet from slipping off. The rest of the hair then was braided into a queue. The same reason applies to modern times soldiers' crew cut(or No.1).Arilang1234 (talk) 20:24, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

Huh?

The text states:

"Once firmly in power, Nurhaci commanded all men in the areas he had conquered to adopt the Manchu hairstyle. The Manchu hairstyle was significant for it distinguished between the Manchus and the indigenous Chinese. It was a symbol of Han Chinese submission to Manchu rule."

So which is it? Was it used to distinguish Chinese and Manchus? Or was it imposed on the Chinese to symbolise submission to the Manchus? It can't be both!

Bathrobe (talk) 02:08, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

wiktionary

From wiktionary: http://en.wiktionary.org/w/index.php?oldid=5961498

queue (plural queues)

(mostly historical) A men's hairstyle whose primary attribute is a braid (sometimes a ponytail, after the French meaning) at the back of the head, such as that worn by men in Imperial China.

---

I don't know what the source of that entry was, but it stated "men's hairstyle" which is an important keyword. The opening paragraph of the current version should mention that, I think. I'll wait for some comment before changing it. Bennylin (talk) 13:18, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Short-haired people

Chinese men tend to have relatively short hair; what if it couldn't grow long enough to braid? Brutannica (talk) 04:53, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Word salad

Some sequence of edits has turned this sentence into word salad:

Rebels in Shangdong tortured the Han official who suggested Dorgon the queue order to death and killed his relatives.

MaxEnt (talk) 01:05, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Immigrants with queues

Why did Chinese immigrants wear them? Why fear the emperor overseas? 75.42.85.114 (talk) 07:58, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

WTF is a "begs" ?

What is the definition of "begs" in these sentences (emphasis added)?

However, after an invasion of Kashgar by Jahangir Khoja, Turkistani muslim begs and officials in Xinjiang eagerly fought for "privilege" of wearing a queue to show their steadfast loyalty to the Empire. High ranking begs were granted this right.

It surely does not refer to beggars with a phrase like "High ranking begs...". Any definition will need a citation since the language is obscure. 66.97.213.202 (talk) 20:20, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

There is a link now. --Error (talk) 00:57, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

Looking for understanding of emotional issues.

I came to this encyclopedia looking for an answer and this article has a total lack of the information I am looking for.

I am not a Chinese cultural scholar but I do enjoy historical and semi-historical Chinese films. In many of these films there have been scenes where a character with a ponytail (either the Manchu shaved style or the longhair plus tail style) either have it cut off by an enemy or else cut it off themselves (such as to go into disguise), always with obvious negative emotions about the loss of the tail (anger and sadness when taken, hesitation to cut it themselves). Why? The impression I get is that it represents some sort of loss of manhood or social status.

BTW, what is the correct name for a Chinese ponytail (single) if the person's head is not shaved? 66.97.213.202 (talk) 22:19, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

Traditionally, Han people male do not have ponytail. An adult male in age 20 will have an adult ceremony, basically it is changing his hairstyle, he should tie his hair and wear a hat, it is called Shufa/束发 and Jiguan/及冠. Our body, hair and skin shouldn't be hurt, because they're given by our parents, Confucius said in Xiao Jing.--刻意(Kèyì) 06:16, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

European Use of the Queue

A form of queue, called by that name, was in common use in much of Europe and in European colonies, during the late eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, and was even mandated for use in the British and other armies. See, for example, Thomas Carter, Curiosities of War & Military Studies (London: 1860), p. 184, which reproduces the July 20, 1808 Royal Order abolishing the queue in the British Army Al-Nofi (talk) 16:55, 20 May 2011 (UTC)

Not a Ponytail

Isn't this a type of plait, not a ponytail? See ponytail. Auximines (talk) 17:11, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Yes. A braid or plait is called a pigtail, not a ponytail. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.74.222.248 (talk) 02:32, 14 November 2011 (UTC)

Rescue from drowning

I read somewhere that the queue among European mariners was justified as a means to pull them to safety if they fell into water since many couldn't swim. --Error (talk) 00:59, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

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Dorgon

Dorgon is mentioned several times in the article, but there is no explanation of who he was or why people should have paid attention to what he said. 216.255.165.198 (talk) 20:08, 22 October 2019 (UTC)

Queue in Xinjiang and Tibet

There is one sentence about the queue in Kashgar, but there is nothing about the queue in Tibet. Did the Tibetans wear the queue? If not, they were not subjects of the Manchu Qing dynasty, right? Geographyinitiative (talk) 06:48, 12 July 2020 (UTC)

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Too much extra info

This article seems to have a lot of extraneous information about various Chinese hairstyles, especially in the "Predecessors and Origin" section. This article is about the queue, and all this other information is just taking of space and making things confusing. I'd like to trim some of it, if nobody has any objections. Tad Lincoln (talk) 02:21, 17 September 2023 (UTC)