Talk:Renaissance (Italian political party)

Requested move 5 May 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: no consensus to move the page to the proposed title at this time, per the discussion below. Dekimasuよ! 01:32, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

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Renaissance (Italian political party) → Rinascimento (political party) – There are literally zero English sources using the translated name "Renaissance" for this tiny (almost irrelevant) party. Furthermore, there are already parties in other countries that are literally called "Renaissance" – the most recent one, and immensely more relevant, the new renaming of Emmanuel Macron's La République En Marche. So I would keep the untranslated Italian name also for easier disambiguation purposes. Yakme (talk) 17:00, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose per WP:UE. Wikipedia policy is to translate foreign-language names to English, unless the untranslated name is widely used in English-language sources. 162 etc. (talk) 01:47, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

  This is blatantly not what WP:UE mandates or suggests. WP:UE states: In deciding whether and how to translate a foreign name into English, follow English-language usage. If there is no established English-language treatment for a name, translate it if this can be done without loss of accuracy and with greater understanding for the English-speaking reader. Also, WP:ENGLISH states that in case of no established usage in English language, for article titles, follow the conventions of the language in which this entity is most often talked about. I do not see any advantage in translating "Rinascimento" to "Renaissance", especially where there is also a disambiguation issue involved. Yakme (talk) 08:04, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

If there is no established English-language treatment for a name, translate it. Seems pretty clear. 162 etc. (talk) 15:23, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

"translate it, if ..." you should read further. Seems clear to me that we should translate it only if it's pretty obvious: example "Partito Marxista Leninista" becomes "Marxist-Leninist Party". However slogans like this one "Rinascimento" always have double meanings, and a translation to English is not always optimal. "Rinascimento" means indeed also "rebirth", and that is probably what the party name is focused on. Yakme (talk) 15:47, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

In that case, the solution is a more accurate translation. No objection to Rebirth (political party). 162 etc. (talk) 16:10, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

That would not be more accurate. There is no way to reproduce the double meaning of "rinascimento" between the historical period (Renaissance) and the actual Italian (rebirth). So any translation cannot be done without loss of accuracy and does not improve the understanding for the English-speaking reader. Yakme (talk) 17:18, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

• Oppose – "Reinaissance" is the natural translation of rinascimento, not of rinascita (rebirth). As such, the case for the current name is "translate it if this can be done without loss of accuracy and with greater understanding for the English-speaking reader". --Checco (talk) 16:58, 10 May 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.