Talk:Results of the 2011 United Kingdom Alternative Vote referendum

Missing Details and Maps

Great to see this page up and running and great work on all the maps! Just wondering why have we not got maps or details of results prepaired for Scottish local counting areas and why is there no map of local counting areas for the London region as we will need this if we are to show results from all 440 local areas. I know Northern Ireland is just one unit but a map of the voting area I feel is still vaild. (MOTOAL1987) 21:50, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

Yeah I think for completeness there should be a map for Northern Ireland in its section, even if it will be coloured in as one colour! As for the missing bits... be patient! ;) David (talk) 22:26, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

The regional maps are not actually meant for this election, but are designed for use on showing districts or constituencies for their respective regions. Hence why England is in orange and Wales, Scotland are in grey on them. Earlier I tried cropping out the regions from the uber map, but it seemed to just crash with the sheer size of it. I'm hoping Nilfanion will produce these cropped maps by Friday afternoon. If anybody else fancies doing it, feel free to do so. The maps we're using are temporary. Jolly Ω Janner 22:29, 4 May 2011 (UTC)

Added the details for the scotland one and the map. Be good if we can get shaded maps to show the results but damned if I know how to do something like that :P Delusion23 (talk) 00:02, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

The maps will be shaded after the results are counted for each district. Once ready it will be relatively easy for someone unfamiliar with the tools to shade the districts. I would advise downloading "Inkscape" if you are interested in doing so. The simplest, but perhaps more computer-intensive method would be to select each district in the map and then use the "Pick colors from image (F7)" tool to chose its colour based on a key (which you simply have to click on), which will be added to maps before Friday's results. If you can't select a district with one click, it may need to be ungrouped using shift+ctrl+g or you could just double click each district to select it on its own. I'd imagen for the uber map, it would be a case of editing the XML code of the image, as viewing the image and doing it with Inkscape's tools would lag most computers severely. If you want to take part in this, download one of the maps and have a play to get familiar with Inkscape. Jolly Ω Janner 00:16, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

I would like to say a word of thanks to all those who are working on this page on the maps. It means we will be able to see with the greatest details like never before which local areas vote YES and which areas vote NO. It is a job well done as well as the most detailed results page that will have been undertaken for a referendum held within the United Kingdom! (MOTOAL1987) 08:53, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

At this rate it looks like we won't be needing maps to illustrate how regions voted as they will just be red versions of what we have already. Though maybe Brighton and Hove will be a little blob of green on the south coast. I'll wait and see... Delusion23 (talk) 16:12, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

We might want maps to show the varying level of support (a more intense red for 70%+ no). If the result is solidly no across the UK, I'd question if there is any real utility in retaining all these tables. If all the votes are no, the regions will show that clearly enough.--Nilfanion (talk) 17:04, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Lambeth just got the first YES, i have put it in green, if you want it as a different colour just say. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slipdisk101 (talk • contribs) 17:22, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Changed to a lighter green - couldn't see the text.

Anyone else got problems with the results site, or is it because I'm in New Zealand? Lcmortensen (mailbox) 17:27, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

No, it's just that everyone is trying to access it at once and their servers can't deal with the traffic. You'd have thought they'd have prepared for this or something... Jolly Ω Janner 17:29, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

• Update: we appear to have several (now four) yes, votes in, so I think this validates the use of the green shades. There should be a few more yes votes to come as well. The question now remains at how low the shading should go. If we only have a few no votes below 22.5%, then the current shading set out on the main talk page will suffice. If we have about 30 or more below that then it could well mean a rethink on the shading classifcation. Jolly Ω Janner 17:54, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Quick count: Broxbourne appears to be the only one below 22.5% so far, so think we're good. Jolly Ω Janner 17:56, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

I've done some 3 tone maps for the fully declared regions using 50% and 65% no as the breakpoints. If more colours are wanted can be redone of course.--Nilfanion (talk) 22:52, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Sorry for the overwrite for London - I got an edit conflict but figured it was a table fix and didn't check to see if it was an image change.

Colors:

no 87.50-100 2b0000

no 75.00-87.49 aa0000

no 62.50-74.99 ff2a2a

no 50.01-62.49 ffaaaa

no 50.00 gray

no 37.51-49.99 aaffaa

no 25.01-37.50 2aff2a

no 12.51-25.00 00aa00

no 0.00-12.50 002b00

Toolserver keeps timeing out when I try to upload the SVG, but if it works I'll note it's done here and not update this page to prevent different color keys. -- Jeandré, 2011-05-06t23:02z

Makes sense to me, once we have the 5 colour and 9 colour versions we can compare directly and think which is more apppropriate to our needs :) I have no real preference - its a judgement call between simplicity or detail.--Nilfanion (talk) 23:06, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Great work on the images :D would a colour key be useful? Delusion23 (talk) 23:54, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

The red and green on the maps match the tables, but the pink? Martinevans123 (talk) 09:11, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

The colour scheme for the 3 tone regional maps is on the file pages - green = "yes", pink=50%-65% no, red = >65% no. It does the job for an initial basic scheme, if more detail is wanted (say 5% or 10% break down) it can be done.--Nilfanion (talk) 17:27, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

Yes the scheme is fine, my point was that in the tables only pink and green are used, i.e. green on map = green in table, but red or pink on map = pink in table. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:27, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Will the regional map of the UK also be colour shaded in this scheme? Also, will there be a map for Northern Ireland? (And the UK regional map needs updating with the NI result in..) David (talk) 10:41, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

Official declarations website

Official declarations website (The Electoral Commission) David (talk) 18:08, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

It appears as though they will publish local results as they are declared, which will provide us with a good stream of information. Jolly Ω Janner 18:14, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Edit conflicts

Really annoying when you spend ages updating the results then someone overwrites it with blanks by not completing their edit conflict properly... Happened too many times now :( Delusion23 (talk) 19:12, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Table layouts

I think it would be better if the "yes" columns were first in the tables, not the "no", its more natural to list the affirmative response first. The fact the result of the referendum is clearly a strong "no" shouldn't affect that - its still more natural to talk about the yes first.--Nilfanion (talk) 20:18, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

I do agree with this however I am unsure of how long it would now take to change everything around. (talk) 23:48, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Shouldn't the status quo be the default option, such as what happens during a tie break vote in the commons, the status quo remains. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.114.23.15 (talk) 22:56, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Main map

Copy of my carping comments from main article (sorry to sound so negative, since obviously a few people have worked hard and very quickly on this): I think the map adds nothing as it stands. In fact it's slightly misleading as the key suggests that if you look hard enough you'll find some green. I'm still looking! ... This map could be replaced with the statement "all regions voted no". I guess many people, myself included, were expecting more of a "General Election"-type of result, where such a regional map might have been useful? But am not convinced as to the relevance of these regions, whatever the result might had been. Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 10:34, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

Firstly, the regions are an official part of the referendum's counting/declaration process; secondly, it could be colour-shaded to show % No vote, like the local counting areas' maps. David (talk) 11:37, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

(ec) Yes, colour shading might be a very big improvement. I wonder what was the rationale behind the official decision to use these regions? And if it is stated explicity anywhere, could it be added to this article? Why were the traditional parliamentary constituencies not used? Or counties? Ot sometheing else with a little more granularity? Thanks. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:48, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

In England most districts had local elections, so it was sensible to combine AV counting with local election counting. Similar in Scotland and Wales where the devolved constituencies were used because they were "in use" otherwise that day. As for the regions - they are a sensible mid-way between the districts of England and the kingdom itself. David (talk) 13:15, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

I know many people are wondering if we should have all these maps when so many areas voted no. I believe that we should keep the regional maps as well as all the local results because it shows how the referendum was conducted and even thou only a handful of areas voted yes it does show the overwheming feeling and decision that the British People viewed in the referendum, thats why we should keep the maps! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.7.60.90 (talk) 11:43, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

I agree that the small maps are very useful. My issue is with the UK map. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:49, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

• As discussed at the other talk page, I intend to make a map shading every district/constituency according to this colour scheme. Hopefully this will be of more use. If anyone has any comments regarding the colour scheme, please let me know. Jolly Ω Janner 13:30, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

That seems very sensible. Thanks for telling us, Jolly Janner. I suppose the one use for the regional map of UK as it stands is that it shows where the regions are. But they key is still a bit pointless. Martinevans123 (talk) 13:43, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

The UK-by-regions map may be useful with more detail - showing where the no support was strongest. But the UK-by-voting area map can do that better IMO.--Nilfanion (talk) 17:29, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

Ontario 2007

British Colombia 2009

Just for reference here are the only results maps for two Canadian provincial referendums on the voting system. Both are similar to the UK in that the only counting areas with a Yes vote were geographically tiny - BC solves this by colouring the metro areas grey on the main map and having a zoom in, Ontario has the province split in two with a slightly different scale.

How do people feel about this set-up? Timrollpickering (talk) 18:15, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

Preferred option for me here would be zoomed in (BC style), with inserts for London, Glasgow/Edinburgh and possibly South Wales. Others are pretty pointless (such as Liverpool/Manchester) as those areas are firm no votes, South Wales was all no but at least quite a few are quite close to 50%.--Nilfanion (talk) 18:36, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

• I'm working my way through it, but thought I would upload it part the way through, so you can see how it looks so far. File:United Kingdom AV referendum area results.svg. Jolly Ω Janner 19:31, 7 May 2011 (UTC)

My word, that looks marvellous. Well done! Martinevans123 (talk) 19:38, 7 May 2011 (UTC)