Talk:Sadomasochism

This article

This article has been created to factor out sadism, masochism, and sado-masochism in the abstract from the article on BDSM.

Lowercase or capital "m"?

I hope I have this right (considering I typed the whole thing myself):

• On Wikipedia, Sadism and Masochism redirects to Sadism and masochism.
• On Wikiquote, Sadism and masochism redirects to Sadism and Masochism.

Brianjd 07:44, 2004 Dec 17 (UTC)

To be written

• Courtly love as a predecessor of masochism?

If so, how so? & is it not arguable that in fact the behaviors themselves precede courts of any kind?

Seratonin and Melatonin

The emotional effects of Seratonin and Melatonin are looking a bit wobbly under current research - revise? Note in main article?

Medical classification

Things have moved on greatly since this article was written. I've pulled in the medical classification section from the BDSM article in its entirety, with a few slight copyedits to reflect the surrounding context. -- The Anome (talk)

Ideas on the article going forward

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result of this discussion was to not split, article already made Plasticwonder (talk) 21:31, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

---

Sadism and Masochism seem to be two differing characteristics which deserve their own articles. Would it be a good idea to split the articles in two? This article in particular has problems (such as tags which have not been addressed), and there is much material for both sadism and masochism to have their own articles. I would like some opinions on this. Plasticwonder (talk) 04:56, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

Please note that Sadism is presently a disambiguation page; Masochism is not. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 10:13, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

Oppose the split. The topics complement each other sufficiently well in this article to remain combined. Splitting the article feels like it would result in a fair amount of overlap or cross-referencing to get a full understanding of the topics, especially where mutual/consensual relationships are concerned. Perhaps a clearer explanation in the medical/forensic classification section would help (this is already tagged) along with a little reorganization to call this out better. That section is where the distinctions between the terms is strongest, and may need an additional link to Sadistic personality disorder somewhere. Also of note, that article and Sexual masochism disorder (hatnote under forensic classification) are obviously labeled as "disorder" while this combined article is more neutral and even positive for those who embrace the concepts. Separate articles may lose the neutral tone without the benefit of the context of the corresponding role. HalJor (talk) 16:45, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Referencing a summary of another Wikipedia article

I've just overhauled the now "Etymology" section to be more factual as there were some uncited claims in there, but I did so based off information in the Wikipedia articles for Sade and Masoch. In one particular spot (I've added an invisible comment after the relevant sentence) there is no citation as the information is summarised from Sade's biographical article - how should I go about citing it, or is it fine to leave as is? I'm a new editor. Thanks. Petalpatter (talk) 10:33, 19 October 2024 (UTC)

@Petalpatter: In short: you can't use Wikipedia as a reference source, see WP:CIRCULAR. But I think that your changes can stand, until somebody challenges them per WP:V. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 12:55, 19 October 2024 (UTC)