Talk:Short SC.7 Skyvan

Aerovan discussion

Is the discussion of the Miles Aerovan relavent since it states that aerovan data wasn't used?

Aerovan

I suppose it was originally provided to dispel the impression that (a) the name and (b) the type of aircraft might give, that Shorts had somehow inherited the concept from the Miles company. Perhaps the comment has some relevance for that reason. I moved it to the end because it was given undue prominence at the beginning of the article. TraceyR 13:05, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Added an introduction to the history (and removed the note) to show the connection with the Miles Aerovan.MilborneOne 23:39, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Early Models

There are no photos of early models. The astazou powered ones, and there was at least one test bed with Siddeley turboprops; quite long and skinny. Ansett and its children would have been major customers, but the machine could not operate safely in the highlands of Papua New Guinea. The astazou was a helicopter engine, and the axial stage, while very efficient at sea level, lost power quickly at altitude. Ansett did purchase machines later on. One of the van's best selling points was single pilot ops and with airline carrier approval. Other operators in PNG found the Garret turbines to have a poor lifespan when operated in regions of volcanic aerosols.220.244.246.102 (talk) 03:18, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Short SC.7 Skyvan/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

The Skyvan is a long-serving transport aircraft with a history dating back to 1963. It has an interesting history, e.g. from the Nepali famine and the Falklands war. It had also a history as an airliner, which could be developed. I believe it is of "mid" importance. But a starter as far as the text goes at this moment.--MoRsE 15:08, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Substituted at 01:14, 12 June 2016 (UTC)

Major overhaul to article (August 2024)

Here are some justifications for the changes I am proposing.

• Introduction; whilst the Skyvan still exists (just about), I will add add a first flight date to the Introduction section in order to give an early clue as to the era it dates from, and hence it's current status. Likewise it 'was' (not 'is') manufactured by Shorts, and it 'was' used by some airlines (including BEA !) - a key fact that seems to have escaped mention in the whole article.

• Introduction; I do NOT buy that the Short 330 & 360 are simply 'stretched' versions; they have different wings, engines, cockpit, undercarriage, and a fuselage that is stretched by a considerable amount, although I suspect it is actually 98% re-designed. I could challenge the original comment with a dated <<citation needed>>, but instead I will make a BOLD edit and state that the Skyvan design merely inspired the subsequent models. Don't be fooled by the rugged boxy design, high wings and twin-tail.

I am also removing the reference to C-23 Sherpa, which is simply a USAF designation, and not even for the Skyvan.

• Design and development; the final two sentences mention USAF 'Sherpa Skyvans', and 'larger Sherpas'. I have never encountered a USAF SC.7 Skyvan, although NASA did operate one for a while (N430NA). And 'larger Sherpas' is merely taking us back towards C-23s again, which is not relevant to the Skyvan article. Again, I could challenge the original comment with a dated <<citation needed>>, but instead I will delete these sentences as unhelpful.

• Operators; Civilian operators. Here in 2024, pretty much everybody is a 'former' operator, but here are some airlines that really should have been mentioned before now.

BEA/British Airways (Scottish Division); Shorts c/ns SH1831, SH1903 & SH1908 Loganair (Scotland); SH1856 Wien Consolidated (USA); SH1837, SH1850 Papuan Airlines (PNG); SH1840, SH1849 Busy Bee/Air Executive (Norway); SH1901, SH1903, SH1908 Olympic Airways; SH1869, SH1870

As a bonus, I have found Wikimedia photos for Papuan, Olympic, and (best of all) a British Airways Skyvan on the beach at Barra. Happy days! WendlingCrusader (talk) 03:04, 4 August 2024 (UTC)

Argentine 'Death Flights'

There is a long and detailed account of the five Argentine Navy/Coast Guard Skyvans and their activities during the Falklands War. There is also a detailed account of the investigation and identification of Skyvan PA-51 as being one of the aircraft involved in the notorious 'death flights' during Argentina's Dirty War, circa 1977.

Whilst both topics involve the Skyvan, the full stories have their own place on Wikipedia, and it's not here. I propose to move the exact detail to more relevant articles (i.e. death flights, Falklands War).

FWIW I have looked into the history of these Argentine Navy Skyvans myself in order to fill in some of the missing timeline. PA-50 and PA-54 were both destroyed in the Falklands. (parts of PA-50 were still visible in 2004, see https://abpic.co.uk/pictures/view/1124071)

PA-51 (c/n SH.1888)

• 1971 - Delivered to Argentine Navy as PA-51
• 1989 - to CAe Aviation (Luxembourg) as LX-ABC, although often seen in Belgium flying for Skydive Moorsele.
• 2002 - to GB Airlink (Florida) as N80GB
• 2019 - to Win Win Aviation as N190WW
• 2023 - purchased by Argentine Government and placed on display at ESMA, Nunez, Buenos Aires

PA-52 (c/n SH.1889) After service in Argentina, in 1995 this Skyvan also appeared on the Luxembourg register with CAE Aviation, albeit only briefly before arriving in the UK as G-BVXW. After a couple of years of light cargo work around the UK, the C of A expired in January 2003, and the aircraft was gradually reduced to spares.

PA-53 (c/n SH.1890) Argentine Skyvan PA-53 (SH.1890) followed a similar route, becoming a skydive hack initially with CAe Aviation, as LX-GHI, and later F-GTHI. In 2013 it found it's way to the USA with Win Win Aviation as N161WW, and finally to Canada as C-GUWW, still launching skydivers as recently as August 2022. (see airhistory.net C-GUWW)

The existence of C-GUWW (ex PA-53) as recently as 2022 means that the claim that 'only PA-51 still existed' is one of a number of incorrect statements that I intend to put right.

WendlingCrusader (talk) 17:50, 6 August 2024 (UTC)