Talk:Slam Dunk (manga)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Scoring

Under Sakuragi's bio, it says that he's trying to score with girls. I believe that is the wrong term used here. Scoring with girls has a connotation of trying to have sex with the girl. I believe that it should be he's trying to ask girls out. I'm going to go ahead and edit it if nobody has any objections.--Big Wang 08:44, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I'd agree with this change. He's just trying to get a date. It's barely getting to first base much less a home run. Echocharlie 17:08, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Player Resemblences

There are some questionable comparisons that I'd like to open up for discussion a bit: Mitsui (Mark Price, Jeff Hornacek), Sendoh (Magic Johnson, Isiah Thomas), and Maki (N/A)

I've always thought Mitsui's natural NBA analog for the time period Slam Dunk was being published was Reggie Miller. Especially later in the series when he's depicted with long lanky arms. I don't think Hornacek was even considered an all-star caliber player until later in his career when he went to the Utah Jazz. Mark Price was a PG most of his career too and doesn't really fit Mitsui's decidedly SG tendencies, aside from his propensity to be very accurate from 3-point range. Really, Miller is the best fit here, not Price or Hornacek.

Sendo's best comparison might be Larry Bird, not Magic or Isiah. Especially since if any player should be compared to Magic, it should be Maki given his skills and his uniform's very Laker-esque colors and qualities. Sendo is quite clearly a forward with great passing skills, not a natural point guard.

Opinions?

I think the better comparison with Sendoh should remain Magic Johnson than Larry Bird for one simple reason: His ability to play multiple positions. Sendoh, in the finals league game against Kainan plays PG, but at the same time, is also depicted as playing both the F and G positions. A minus against the comparison is the fact that he is specifically noted as having scored 47 points against Shohoku in the previous year--indicating he was a pure scorer and not a passing threat early in his career. So the primary characteristic of Sendoh is that he is a former pure scorer who morphed into an all-round player who can take over games at key times--reminicent of Michael Jordan in some ways, minus the rings. However in the end, the emphasis of the manga is on his passing skills, and his ability to take over a game if needed, which seems to indicate Magic Johnson.

The current comparison which i have the most problem with right now is Uozumi to Shaq--this is simply not right. Uozumi is noted as being someone who lacks Akagi's ability to score--he specifically notes in one case where he say of himself, unlike Akagi, i lack the natural instict for scoring. So Uozumi can be characterized primary as an offensive hub who mostly passes, and contributes mostly through grabbing rebounds and playing defense, and is riduclously tall. I think of Georghe Muresan. I think Akagi, with is bad free throw shooting, solid (but not riduclous) height, power, and lack of outside shooting makes him a far better comparison to shaq.

Echocharlie 05:24, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

I object to the player resemblences entirely, and feel they should be removed. They are purely a matter of opinion, and each of them can be debated extensively. In addition, it's almost impossible to find a perfect match among real life players. For example, while Akagi has the height and power of Shaq, he's primarily known as a defensive specialist, which is more like Ewing. Another example would be Miyagi being compared to Payton - Miyagi is very small but fast, while Payton is tall for a point guard. A real life small-but-fast point guard would be Allen Iverson, but again Miyagi doesn't quite resemble him because Iverson likes to shoot and score while Miyagi is more of a passer.

In conclusion, I feel that these player resemblences do not belong in an encyclopedia and should be removed.--Bhamv 07:37, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Well I think you are wrong there, those players comparisons are pretty nice. The only thing is they needed an update. For exemple, as you said, Miyagi is a fast point guard, with a pass-first mentality, so he should be compared to Chris Paul, who is exactly the same, small, skinny, but quick and a good passer. As for Akagi, he isn't like Shaq at all, Akagi was in the average height for a center in Japan and a defensive player, a leader and with limited offensive moves, so a reference to Ben Wallace fits him the best in my opinion. Those old comparisons were good, but that era has ended, it's better to compare them to basketball players of our days.

tmacthenumber1 00:06, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

If there are going to be player resemblances, I think that they should be compared to NBA players that were playing at the time when the manga was published. For example, Chris Paul, Dwayne Wade, etc. were not even in the league when the manga was first published and would not have inspired the author to create these characters. --theorb 05:23, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

That's a good point, but this site being a motor of research, the comparisons should be updated for a better understanding, no? Or perhaps, we could put up the old comparisons and the new ones? Because the old ones weren't very good. Some were awful, the comparison of Sawakita with Penny Hardaway was just...not good. Sawakita being the best player in the country needs a comparison to a player who was the best. Also, Penny was more of a passing shooting guard, which Sawakita isn't.--tmacthenumber1 12:24, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Chewbaccadude 2:32, 01 September 2006 (UTC)

This was concerning Sendoh's player resemblance which should best classfied as Scottie Pippen
, due to the fact that he scored 47 points against Shohoku which is similar to the career high of Pippen along with the point-forward skills displayer by Sendoh.

--Chewbaccadude 2:32, 01 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, some are still pretty lame, ok if you wanna keep the old schools comparisons, but at least make it so its good, like akagi, damn he is not the same as ewing, he is way more like David Robinson. And Nobunaga, Sprewell? Are you kidding me? The Allen Iverson one was pretty good, or perhaps spud webb, but please, sprewell, ew....--tmacthenumber1 1:53, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

See, this is my point exactly. Is there a player, past present or maybe even future, who can serve as a perfect comparison for any of the Slam Dunk characters? Comparing Hanamichi to Rodman is the only one that comes close, I think. Every other character can be debated until the cows come home. What are the qualities of Ewing and Robinson, and what makes them similar to Akagi? What are the qualities of Sprewell, and what makes him dissimilar to Nobunaga?

As for the comparisons helping as a frame of reference for researchers, I'll admit they're probably helpful to get the appropriate mental image. The problem is that these mental images arise from the opinions of other people; they're not factual, and as thus do not belong in an encyclopedia. Perhaps a disclaimer regarding the lack of factuality could be added, if the majority feel the player comparisons should be kept.Bhamv 07:38, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

Ok, some of the comparisons are getting out of hand now. Right now the current version of the page has Akira Sendoh's real-life comparison as Shawn Kemp. Apparently someone thinks Sendoh is a power-based center/forward, or that Kemp has the all-round skills of a point forward, including no-look passes and three-pointers.

While the majority of editors here appear to feel that the player resemblences should be kept, due to their usefulness, such content clearly goes against Wikipedia policy. Firstly, articles should be a NPOV collection of facts. While a description of a character from fiction can be seen as NPOV, assigning characters a real-life counterpart is not. The repeated edits to the player resemblences is clear indication of this. Secondly, Wikipedia content should be verifiable; how do you verify whether Akagi resembles Shaquille O'Neal or Patrick Ewing more? Thirdly, Wikipedia articles should not include original research; have these comparisons been published anywhere else? Do they have any primary or secondary sources as support?

So I propose this solution as an alternative: I'll edit the article and player descriptions, and include descriptions of their playing styles into the content. If individual readers feel my descriptions match a real-life player, then they can come to their own conclusions and form their own mental connections. For example, my description of Rukawa would mention his high level of skill, off-court fights and conflicts with his team-mates, selfish play style, and rivalry with Sendoh. My description for Uozumi would mention his extreme height and power, and his rivalry with (and inability to beat) Akagi. My description for Mitsui would include his past talent as a junior high player, his injury and delinquency, his three-point skills, and his stamina problems. All of these descriptions are verifiable from the manga and anime. If readers form their own mental connections and think of Kobe or Shaq or Reggie Miller, that's their business.

If someone has another alternative idea, I'm open to suggestions. Also, if someone opposes these changes, I'm also very open to discussion. Otherwise, I think I'll implement the changes after a couple of weeks. Bhamv 13:36, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Adding characters

I suggest that some strong Slam dunk characters be added. Players like Masashi, Jin, Hanagata and such.

Support

1. User:tmacthenumber1 01:46, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

I think adding Jin is warranted because he was one of the top 5 players to come out of the Kanagawa trials. I also suggest adding Fukuda. --BrokenSphere 18:33, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

What about the characters that appear after the anime. Especially those on the Sannoh team like Sawakita or Kawata. -- Shaman88 09:41, 31 October 2006 (UTC)

Oppose

Merge

It has been suggested that Kaede Rukawa be merged into this article

Support

1. Squilibob 02:32, 23 September 2006 (UTC) Bhamv 07:38, 30 September 2006 (UTC)Shaman88 09:38, 31 October 2006 (UTC) Annie D 02:15, 14 November 2006 (UTC), Master2841 17:38, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Oppose