Talk:Springfield, Ohio

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2024/June

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Why aren't there any infos about town government here?

Really, where's any info about the town council and recent elections? Who's in charge there? Inquiring minds would like to know. Springfieldians, please add those facts! Gray62 (talk) 21:26, 3 September 2024 (UTC)

Done--Chimino (talk) 17:17, 15 September 2024 (UTC)

Places of worship section

After viewing several cities' Wikipedia pages, it appears that a section for 'Places of worship' is not the norm. Personally, I don't see the significance of the section and feel it should be removed. I look forward to feedback from others regarding this. Dogscatsbirds (talk) 13:06, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

A good place for guidance is WP:City structure. My opinion would be to remove any non-notable (generally meaning not having an article or other form of significance) locations.--☾Loriendrew☽ ☏(ring-ring) 20:26, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

Sometimes reliable sources (as in newspaper articles) talk about religion characterizing a community, like Katy, Texas being known as the "City of Churches" (from this source). But if the newspapers don't talk about the significance of religion in the community, there may be less of a need to talk about the churches. WhisperToMe (talk) 16:25, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

20,000 immigrants in five years but the population has gone down?

The Demographics section of this article, as in the articles for many municipalities, includes a box for Historical Population which shows that Springfield's population declining from a peak above 80,000 in 1960 and 1970 to about 61,000 in 2010, about 59,000 in 2020, and about 58,000 estimated in 2023.

Meanwhile, the last paragraph of the History section, supported by two links to the Springfield News-Sun, says: "By 2024, an estimated 15,000-20,000 Haitian refugees had settled in the city" (the links says this migration happened over a period of five years) and that local officials say this influx caused "an increased use of city services for which they were not prepared."

These points need not be in conflict, but it does raise questions about whether the population would have been down to 40,000 or so if not for the immigrants, and whether the local authorities had budgeted for that much lower number of people to support. Maybe someone with more knowledge of Springfield can find some reliable sources that explain this. NME Frigate (talk) 01:59, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

The estimate likely reflects close to none of the Haitian migrants as they are difficult to formally track. City & state estimates are based on subjective factors like an increase in healthcare needs, school enrollment, vehicle registrations, etc. I suspect (hopefully) the next US Census will be much different.—Chimino (talk) 22:53, 10 September 2024 (UTC)

Sure, fine, but then someone link to those city or state estimates. And actually, why are the Haitians harder to "formally track" than anybody else who lives in Springfield? They've been moving there for the work, and if they have jobs, they presumably are able to afford housing. The city of Springfield's website* says there are an estimated 12,000-15,000 immigrants in Clark County, and it doesn't restrict that to Haitian immigrants or to recently arrived immigrants. So that right there calls into question the statement mentioned above that 15,000-20,000 Haitian immigrants moved into Springfield -- whose population is something like half of Clark County as a whole -- over approximately the past five years.

• https://springfieldohio.gov/immigration-faqs/

NME Frigate (talk) 06:49, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

Well if you can find official estimates that put the population at a higher number than currently stated, please add them.—Chimino (talk) 15:36, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

@Chimino I think it makes more sense for someone to provide any evidence at all of 20,000 Haitians living in Springfield 2600:1003:A410:C42:711:16C8:36F2:CBAA (talk) 10:33, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

20,000 estimate was given by city officials, as seen in the links provided.—Chimino (talk) 14:56, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

As noted above, the city's website has a lower number: 12,000-15,000.

(And that's for the whole county, not just Springfield.)

This Reuters article indicates that there were 3,500 Haitian immigrants in 2020 and then cites the city's 12,000-15,000 figure:

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/haitian-immigrants-fueled-springfields-growth-now-us-presidential-debate-2024-09-11/

This article, citing various government data sources, estimates 10,000:

https://www.the-downballot.com/p/all-the-estimates-of-springfields?r=dena&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email&triedRedirect=true

But The Downballot might not be considered reliable. That article was cited at Talking Points Memo:

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/a-very-important-read

The latter piece also notes a Kevin Drum article which cites US Census data indicating the city's non-native-born population as of 2022 was less than 3,000:

https://jabberwocking.com/how-many-haitian-immigrants-really-live-in-springfield-maybe-2000/

But again, that source may not up to Wikipedia's standards.

The separate article on the "cat eating" stories is using a figure of 12,000-20,000. I suggest that this article do the same. And thus this sentence:

"By 2024, an estimated 15,000 to 20,000 legal Haitian immigrants had settled in the city."

Could be changed to read as follows

"By 2024, an estimated 12,000 to 20,000 legal Haitian immigrants had settled in the city and surrounding area."

With citation to the city's website added to the two citations already attached to that sentence. NME Frigate (talk) 18:03, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

city and surrounding area seems too vague in my humble opinion. per the .gov site, specifying Clark County seems like a better fit. 189.152.84.106 (talk) 23:35, 22 September 2024 (UTC)

Translation ideas for FRwiki and HTwiki

Hello! Reminding people to reach out to those on FRwiki and HTwiki who edit US articles so important parts of this article are translated for Haitian residents. Some Haitians may prefer French, and some may prefer Creole, so I recommending covering both of those bases. Also consider having the article on the school district with the majority of the area translated into French and Haitian. WhisperToMe (talk) 02:33, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Trump and Springfield

The false claims Donald Trump made about the eating of dogs and cats in Springfield is correctly referenced in the article. However I wonder whether this warrants its own paragraph. After all, these bizarre claims have now catapulted Springfield into global attention. What do other editors think? Research17 (talk) 19:50, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

There's an entire article about it Springfield, Ohio cat-eating hoax WhisperToMe (talk) 20:52, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Well, as one of the very few people who was editing this page before this week, I agree. Hopefully after the election when the city is a footnote to history, we can do away with the recentism and put this mess into historical context.—Chimino (talk) 02:57, 14 September 2024 (UTC)

Cat-eating hoax

I'm concerned the Cat-eating hoax section is dominating the article, giving too much into recentism, especially since there already is a separate article containing the same information. PRRfan's edits in particular, while in good faith, seem to be excessive. I also do not believe the hoax fits in the lede of the article. Thanks--Chimino (talk) 22:45, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

I agree with you, as least with regards to my own edits. I have added too much detail about the late unpleasantness, and I will presently move most of it over the the main cat-eating-hoax article, leaving a representative sample. But I do think it merits inclusion in the lead, even adjusting for recentism, as it is certainly the city's most nationally (and even internationally) significant event since, perhaps, the founding of International Harvester. PRRfan (talk) 23:52, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

Transportation

The current section on transportation is missing pretty much everything about public transportation as of today. It doesn't even mention that there are buses being ran, or the name of the agency responsible for public transportation, much less that fixed bus lines (as far as I can read there were 7) were abolished recently. A link to the website of the city, specifically regarding SCAT (transport in Springfield): https://springfieldohio.gov/SCAT/ https://springfieldohio.gov/springfield-city-area-transit-scat/ 86.92.89.111 (talk) 15:41, 25 September 2024 (UTC) not logged in