Talk:T. T. Toliver/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Harrias (talk · contribs) 12:06, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

Early years

• "130 of 219 passes for 1,959 yards and 16 touchdowns with 10 interceptions while rushing for 1,098 yards and 15 touchdowns" Lots of jargon in here which would do with either explanation or wikilinks.

This type of writing seems to be common in the football world. I added some wikilinks. If you have anything else to say about it, feel free. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 04:24, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Wikilinks are fine with me. Harrias ^talk 09:53, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

• What are Class 5A and Class 6A, again an explanation or wikilink would be good.

I added some wikilinks. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 04:24, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Professional career

• The current layout isn't great: some sections have just one or two lines, which looks a bit odd. Maybe split it into "NFL career", with one section talking about all his NFL stuff, and then go into his AFL career. I know that isn't quite right chronologically, but the chronology isn't quite right at the moment anyway, given the Tampa Bay Storm section goes beyond the two subsequent sections.

The reason for the overlap is because he was technically still a member of the Storm while he was with the 49ers and Buccaneers. He was on the Storm's "exempt" list. When he left the Buccaneers, he was activated off the exempt list by the Storm. (as seen here on April 25, 2003). I haven't completely decided what to do here yet. I was just explaining the reason the article was organized like that. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 06:14, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

It's up to you, it just looks quite broken up at the moment with all the small sections, so it doesn't flow so well. Harrias ^talk 09:53, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

I removed the section headings and reorganized the article chronologically. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 03:35, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

• What is a practice squad, an explanation or wikilink would be good.  Done
• Lots of jargon in the Tampa Bay Storm section; anything not explained or linked in the section above needs to be here.
• "Toliver became the first person to win an ArenaBowl and Super Bowl in the same year when the Storm won ArenaBowl XVII against the Arizona Rattlers on June 22, 2003." This is a little bit confusing, as we haven't seen him win the Super Bowl yet, as that is in a later section. Could be solved if you adopt my first point, otherwise needs looking at.
• On this point, the reference talks about him being the first player to be "on teams that won a Super Bowl and Arena League championship in the same year". As he didn't get a Super Bowl ring, can he really be said to have won a Super Bowl?

Every player that is on the roster for the Super Bowl winning team is included in the Super Bowl championship navigational boxes here on Wikipedia. They also all have Super Bowl champion as a highlight in their infoboxes. Different teams seem to have different rules for rewarding rings. Robert Myers was with the Broncos for less games than Toliver was with the Buccaneers and he got a ring. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 04:24, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

• "while also totaling 54.5 tackles" What is .5 of a tackle?!

I'll rewrite it as solo tackles and tackle assists. The 54.5 was the total number of tackles. A solo tackle is one that is done by the player all by himself. A tackle assist (counted as 0.5 a tackle) is one that is completed by two or more players. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 04:24, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

• "to the All-Ironman Team in 2004" What is an "All-Ironman Team?"  Done
• Would it be worth adding more detail to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers section about how many games he was with the team?  Done
• "Toliver was assigned to the Tampa Bay Storm.." What do you mean by "assigned"; did he have a choice in the matter? Is there anything about whether there was any animosity on rejoining the Storm, given he had previously "informed head coach Tim Marcum that he no longer wanted to play for the Storm"?

He did choose to play for the Storm but in the relaunched AFL (the league returned in 2010 from a one-year hiatus), when a player agrees to play for a certain team, they actually sign a contract with the league instead. Then the league assigns them to the certain team (as can be seen here, all the transactions before the league's relaunch around December 2009 say "signed" while all the later ones say "assigned"). I think this is how it all works. I couldn't find any sources discussing this. I think I saw something about it on a message board post once. If there were some sources discussing this, we could add a note about it in the article but I haven't found any. Regarding the animosity, I couldn't find anything. It was seven years later and the team was way different by then. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 04:24, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Makes sense, no worries. Harrias ^talk 09:53, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

• "On June 1, 2017, he was placed on injured reserve." Any details on what the injury was?

Unfortunately, I couldn't find any sources. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 06:14, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

References

• Ref #2 should be formatted like ref #3. (Orlando Sentinel, not orlandosentinel.com)  Done
• Similarly, ref #4 should show St. Petersburg Times  Done
• Check the rest of the references for similar cases, there are a few more at least.  Done

Overall, this is another good piece of work. My one slight criticism is that it reads like a string of statistics; if possible, it would be nice to be able to add a bit more meat, maybe some quotes about his play if possible? (This article has a few nice things that might be added, particularly about his longevity. An explanation of his nickname (found here would be good too. Harrias ^talk 12:06, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: I can see you're still active, working on other pages, just wanted to check you remembered that there were a few things outstanding on this one. Harrias ^talk 09:40, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, did just see that you'd made some more changes to this article. I'm going crazy. Harrias ^talk 09:42, 16 November 2017 (UTC)

• I added the part about his nickname. Also, I'm not sure if there is anything to add from the first article you linked. I have a sentence at the end of the article saying he's the oldest player in the league. Thoughts? WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 03:47, 18 November 2017 (UTC)
  • @WikiOriginal-9: Thanks, the article is looking good now. If you could just sort out references #25, 26, 27, then I think it'll be a pass. Harrias ^talk 17:31, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

Done. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 03:01, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

Nice work on all this, happy to pass now. Harrias ^talk 08:57, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

@Harrias: Thanks for the review. WikiOriginal-9 (talk) 00:07, 20 November 2017 (UTC)