Talk:The Tennessee Three

Requested move 7 April 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) {{ping|ClydeFranklin}} (t/c) 01:28, 14 April 2023 (UTC)

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The Tennessee Three → The Tennessee Three (band) – While I’m not sure if The Tennessee Three (Tennessee House of Representatives) can be called the primary search term yet, it does seem like they’re on par with each other, with one being a famous artist’s backing band, and the other a very high profile group of politicians, so disambiguating this page seems wise MRN2electricboogaloo (talk) 00:43, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. Why does Tennessee Three (Tennessee House of Representatives) even exist? Completely redundant to 2023 Tennessee House of Representatives expulsions and barely more than a stub. Even if it did support its own article, this is an incredibly WP:RECENT move request, given that Johnny Cash's band has been notable for decades, and the explusion incident literally just happened. --Quiz shows 01:25, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose - WP:RECENTISM. I also agree with per @Quiz shows's comment about the redundancy of the other article, and I have proposed a merge. Estar8806 (talk) 01:26, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

Considering that the page cited in the nomination has now been made a redirect, I would suggest a speedy/procedural close. Estar8806 (talk) 03:00, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

The Tennessee Three (Tennessee House of Representatives) having been made a redirect does not mean The Tennessee Three shouldn't be a disambiguating page that includes a link to 2023 Tennessee House of Representatives expulsions.  Ved havet 🌊 (talk)  23:23, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

• Support (in part). Something needs to be done. I support the change of this article to The Tennessee Three (band) with the Tennessee Three (Tennessee House of Representatives) redirect being left alone.
  

MOST people, most of WP's customers, most readers over the next week, the next months, possibly in the coming years, will be searching for "Tennessee Three" or "The Tennessee Three" and they will be looking for an article about the 3 Tennessee legislators. If you Google/search the term the TN subject is what overwhelmingly comes up. Regardless of possible Recentism, I think we need to be cognizant of the present reality...this political occurrence is a probable watershed moment in American politics - in all likelihood the terms "Tennessee Three"/"The Tennessee Three" will become a moniker on the scale of "Watergate" meaning the political scandal that brought Richard Nixon down (break-in by his "Plumbers"-bunch and the subsequent cover-up) instead of the actual building in Washington DC. At the very least (in my opinion) a disambiguation page for "Tennessee Three"/"The Tennessee Three" should probably be instituted. Regardless of our internal procedures/niceties, we should be here to make things clear and to make information easier to find and to verify. Shearonink (talk) 13:51, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose the hatnote is more than enough at this point. Could re-evaluate later but the long-term significance isn't there for moving yet. Elli (talk | contribs) 18:32, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Weak support - I know, WP:CRYSTAL and WP:RECENTISM and all, but I think it's safe to say that the House Ten. 3 has easily become the primary topic in a few days. I mean, just look at the page views for the band article, which has skyrocketed since the expulsions. It's pretty clear that the Tennessee three of today will be more relevant a decade down the line than this one. - Knightsoftheswords281 (Talk-Contribs) 18:49, 7 April 2023 (UTC)
• Support no reason the band can't have (band) In ictu oculi (talk) 20:01, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose per recentism. It is too soon to determine whether or not this will remain the primary topic.

Bneu2013 (talk) 20:03, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Weak oppose — Show me sustained coverage and I'll change my oppose to a support. The Tennessee Three are not this generation's Chicago Seven, at least for now. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 20:37, 7 April 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Per recentism. BlueShirtz (talk) 03:07, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

• Support for clarity and accuracy. Tennessee Three of the past iOS a band. Tennessee Three of the present which out what most people are searching for today are a group of 3 important political figures that are making history. 136.56.5.110 (talk) 14:33, 8 April 2023 (UTC)

  Again, this falls under WP:RECENTISM. It's too early to say if this will stay as the primary topic. BlueShirtz (talk) 02:17, 9 April 2023 (UTC)

• Comment: WP:RECENTISM is an explanatory essay. It is not a Wikipedia guideline and it is not Wikipedia policy. A Wikipedia policy that seems to me to be more relevant would be the subsections of WP:TITLE, Use commonly recognizable names which states:

"Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it generally prefers the name that is most commonly used (as determined by its prevalence in a significant majority of independent, reliable English-language sources)"[Bolding & underlining mine]

and also WP:NAMECHANGES:

"Sometimes the subject of an article will undergo a change of name. When this occurs, we give extra weight to independent, reliable English-language sources ("reliable sources") written after the name change. If the reliable sources written after the change is announced routinely use the new name, Wikipedia should follow suit and change relevant titles to match. If, on the other hand, reliable sources written after the name change is announced continue to use the established name, Wikipedia should continue to do so as well, as described above in "Use commonly recognizable names". ... We do not know what terms or names will be used in the future, but only what is and has been in use, and is therefore familiar to our readers."[Bolding mine]

Seems to me that maybe what should be under consideration is 1)which usage/term and 2)which meaning is most commonly-recognizable/most familiar to our readers. Shearonink (talk) 03:15, 9 April 2023 (UTC)

Support, as I personally believe the Recentism concerns don't necessarily help our readers; I find it necessary to disambiguate. Plus, RECENTISM is an essay, not a guideline, and the Tenessee Three is a commonly recognizable name. I would further cite that WP:READER is a better essay to guide us as opposed to WP:RECENTISM, as Knightsoftheswords' page views and the following news sources (WSJ, BBC, Daily Beast, FOX 32 Chicago, MSNBC, Yahoo News Australia, Hindustan News Hub, Deutsche Welle, and CBS) all use or at least mention the term "Tennessee Three". Such usage, as much as we could disagree with it if we wanted to, is what's happening, and Wikipedia is supposed to reflect what is happening, not decide what should happen. It's why we title the storming of the Capitol which happened on January 6, 2021, as the January 6 United States Capitol attack, or the 2001 plane hijackings and terrorist on the World Trade Center and two other sites as the September 11 attacks; we use what the world has been calling this. While there isn't sufficient media to justify moving the expulsions themselves to Tennessee Three, given that most of the sources I provided list the Tennessee Three as a nickname and not the name of the incident, there is overwhelming evidence from across the English-speaking world (as well as English media from other countries) as presented by myself and by the previous commenters that at the bare minimum, a disambiguation is necessary. InvadingInvader (userpage, talk) 22:52, 11 April 2023 (UTC)

• Strong Oppose: Not only is this huge WP:RECENTISM, The Tennessee Three (Tennessee House of Representatives) is a redirect. I think it's safe to say that the band is the primary Tennessee Three. GamerKiller2347 (talk) 02:43, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose: Lots of predictions on the staying power of this term. We'll see. Hatnote is sufficient for now. Fettlemap (talk) 05:14, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
• Strong Oppose Recentism. A few days ago there was only one subject using this term, and in the near future, the article for this historic band will be getting more hits on WP than the political event. --rogerd (talk) 02:09, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

"and in the near future, the article for this historic band will be getting more hits on WP that the political event." I was wondering what the basis is for your statement. Shearonink (talk) 03:48, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

Just conjecture. IMO, this will fade away in the public consciousness in 6 months to a year and the legacy of the musicians will endure. Perhaps I shouldn't have said that, because it is just my opinion. rogerd (talk) 06:17, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

• Wait. Having this event in recent memory will cloud our judgement on its notability. We should reevaluate in two or three months time to see if there is long-term significant usage of "The Tennessee Three" for the political event. Currently it's in the news, but it's hard to make any evaluations without envoking WP:CRYSTAL. BappleBusiness^[talk] 22:46, 13 April 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.